Fantasy Wars (was: Re: Fantasy accusations /Was: Hi y'all!)

Question:

Dear Ric, you’re perfectly right! I understand your disappointment when facing this anonymous who claims to have a so-called "official" ASL FAQ. Now, it is obvious that nobody is in charge for anything official for an unmoderated Usenet group. That the anonymous may be, is also hilarious! Even more pathetic the "honest love" issue. It is like criticizing "kind regards", as regards were supposed to be rude! Sheer nonsense. The good people of ASL know you and our honesty is too appreciated to give any credibility to that pathetic slander. Be well, my friend Kind regards Raffaele On Tue, 04 Jan 2000 23:26:38 GMT "ric" <asl…@XYZegroups.com> wrote: – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> you know, more than a year ago this was tried and > I succumbed and became upset, mind reading and claiming > you know my intentions… it’s too familar and without > credibility not to be amused… and if you do not wish > to amuse me, then perhaps > you should stop trying to get my attention this way > truth is, people have their own minds and shall judge > for themselves… and I > wouldn’t have it any other way … here’s my entire 3 line email to you > since you seem to have read a whole lot more than I wrote: > pathetic and SPAM > do it again and I’ll report you to AOL > honest love, smiles, and hugs, ric > that’s it… the entire email I sent to you is above in those 3 lines… your > attempt to provoke me is pathetic… your sending unsolicited advertisements for > your website is SPAM… your ISP defines the word, so complain to AOL… > especially when it is a website embroiled in a two year old flame war in a > public newsgroup… your website is the Official ASL FAQ, I assume… and your > chosen name and posts are the only ones mentioning an ASL FAQ and obviously you > are upsetting a couple of people here judging from their verbally violent > opposition and condemnation of an Official ASL FAQ… > you claim not to know me and yet you seem to judge not only my character, but my > intentions… you can be assured of more of my silence this way… I do not > enjoy judgmental people much especially when they admit knowing nothing about > me… I do my best to ignore such prejudicial judges… if we have never met, > perhaps we should keep it that way, based on your hostility and the words you > wrote below… I still wish you peace and happiness and genuine hugs and smiles > > honest love, ric

– Free audio & video emails, greeting cards and forums Talkway – http://www.talkway.com – Talk more ways (sm)

Response:

Hi Ric and Harvey! To keep it short and simple: I think that the question stated by Harvey at the beginnig (thread "Question") were innocent. Attempts to twist it to serve selfish agendas followed, but I don’t see how he may be blamed for that. I see no reason why the both of you shouldn’t come to good terms then. Best wishes Raffaele On Tue, 04 Jan 2000 23:26:35 GMT "ric" <asl…@XYZegroups.com> wrote: > Your Name Here = Harvey wrote in message <946966433.841…@Chaos.es.co.nz>…

<snip> — Free audio & video emails, greeting cards and forums Talkway – http://www.talkway.com – Talk more ways (sm)

Response:

And this laughable bit of garbage was brought to you by NMB, Anonymous <nob…@newsfeeds.com>… One of the biggest anonymous abusers this group has ever had to endure… (paraphrased from NMB’s ridiculous post) And who is this person I wonder? He uses "newsfeeds", and we have one person here who uses "newsfeeds.com, and I’m pretty sure we all know who he is. Of course I could be wrong, just as I *know* that NMB is wrong about whom he is trying to imply is "ASLFAQ", an anonymous poster, who simply speaks the Truth… But what is sad, is that you, ric, and raffaele think if you pose hard enough, and simply go on ignoring the truth, that people will somehow believe your garbage… very sad indeed… Michael In article <3872945D.69D2C…@bellsouth.net>, Anonymous <nob…@newsfeeds.com> wrote: <more typical troll garbage from nmb snipped>

Response:

Your Name Here = Harvey wrote in message <946966433.841…@Chaos.es.co.nz>… >I wrote a reply, but the gremlins in my newsreader, attacked and I lost >my reply. ICQ me is the best way for me to answer your queries. >I can’t write another reply again, in case the gremlins attack again. >Harvey

but Harvey, they are attacking again… the only problem I have with this, Harvey… is that you have, perhaps inadvertently, started a new episode of unprovoked abuse aimed at me… just as your "Question" thread did… seems some would not like us to be friends… I’ll discuss this matter here, in email, in ICQ (2119422) or anywhere… it seems we are in a similar position, that negativity is following us around and you are being championed, though I don’t see anyone condemning you for it… of course it would be irrational to blame you for another’s actions, so don’t read this as suggesting that.. I hope it stops so we can have an objective conversation… honest love, ric "To watch the distant moonlight fill The coming of the tides To understand that life is more Than always choosing sides" ~~ John Denver ~~

Response:

you know, more than a year ago this was tried and I succumbed and became upset, mind reading and claiming you know my intentions… it’s too familar and without credibility not to be amused… and if you do not wish to amuse me, then perhaps you should stop trying to get my attention this way truth is, people have their own minds and shall judge for themselves… and I wouldn’t have it any other way … here’s my entire 3 line email to you since you seem to have read a whole lot more than I wrote: pathetic and SPAM do it again and I’ll report you to AOL honest love, smiles, and hugs, ric that’s it… the entire email I sent to you is above in those 3 lines… your attempt to provoke me is pathetic… your sending unsolicited advertisements for your website is SPAM… your ISP defines the word, so complain to AOL… especially when it is a website embroiled in a two year old flame war in a public newsgroup… your website is the Official ASL FAQ, I assume… and your chosen name and posts are the only ones mentioning an ASL FAQ and obviously you are upsetting a couple of people here judging from their verbally violent opposition and condemnation of an Official ASL FAQ… you claim not to know me and yet you seem to judge not only my character, but my intentions… you can be assured of more of my silence this way… I do not enjoy judgmental people much especially when they admit knowing nothing about me… I do my best to ignore such prejudicial judges… if we have never met, perhaps we should keep it that way, based on your hostility and the words you wrote below… I still wish you peace and happiness and genuine hugs and smiles honest love, ric "now to see things clear, it’s hard enough I know when you’re waiting for reality to show when you’re dreaming of a perfect love and holding it so high above you could stumble on to something real and never know you’d never know you could be with somebody who’s lonely too sometimes it doesn’t show and they might be trying to get across to you words can be so slow when only emptiness is all that’s getting through there comes a time when there’s no point in further talking I passed that point long ago… ~~Jackson Browne ~~ – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -ASLFAQ wrote in message <20000104020400.16283.00000…@ng-fi1.aol.com>… >>>There is no honest love, just love. >>please explain this one… have a problem with my signature?… >Ric, when you use that signature right after being offensive, you make yourself >out to be a hypocrite. >Go ahead and ignore me, ric. The facts are out in the open: You bullied me, and >I called you on it. And with your silence, you pretend to be making a >statement against anonymous posters! Well, if I was a blatant flamer, I’d >agree. But I had never said anything offensive to anyone in this ng, including >you. You threatened me in my private email for some unknown reason, and now >that I brought it out in the open, you use the flimsy excuse of my anon name to >not answer. >You have shown your true colors to everyone, ric. I guess I’m not surprised >that you couldn’t come up with an honest answer that would require true >strength of character. I suppose I’m better off with nothing, rather than >have to try to read through another one of your long pages of hypocritical, >self-centered essays. >My name may be anonymous, but I am very real, and I have grown to love this >group. But now I understand what so many people were complaining about when >news of your "Second Coming" hit the ng. >It’s simple, in my opinion. What you did was hurtful and uncalled for, and I >will never see "honest anything" in your words from now on. I hope others will >beware of your sweet signature line. >-ASLFAQ

Response:

Yes, you are wrong, slandering one of the finest people we have in this group, a man by the name of Mike Brady. Michael, you should be ashamed of yourself. But I will not return your sour attitude. Peace be unto you, Maddogg. I hope you start coming around one day. NMB – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Maddogg wrote: > And this laughable bit of garbage was brought to you > by NMB, Anonymous <nob…@newsfeeds.com>… > One of the biggest anonymous abusers this group has > ever had to endure… > (paraphrased from NMB’s ridiculous post) > And who is this person I wonder? He uses "newsfeeds", > and we have one person here who uses "newsfeeds.com, > and I’m pretty sure we all know who he is. > Of course I could be wrong, just as I *know* that NMB is > wrong about whom he is trying to imply is "ASLFAQ", an > anonymous poster, who simply speaks the Truth… > But what is sad, is that you, ric, and raffaele think if you > pose hard enough, and simply go on ignoring the truth, > that people will somehow believe your garbage… very sad > indeed… > Michael > In article <3872945D.69D2C…@bellsouth.net>, Anonymous <nob…@newsfeeds.com> > wrote: > <more typical troll garbage from nmb snipped>

——–== Posted Anonymously via Newsfeeds.Com ==——- Featuring the worlds only Anonymous Usenet Server ———–== http://www.newsfeeds.com ==———-

Response:

Rainbow Knight wrote: > Dear Ric, > you’re perfectly right! > I understand your disappointment when facing this anonymous > who claims to have a so-called "official" ASL FAQ. Now, it > is obvious that nobody is in charge for anything official > for an unmoderated Usenet group. > That the anonymous may be, is also hilarious!

I agree. I think this anonymous person is giving all anonymous posters a bad name. I post anonymously because of all the ebombs and computer break ins that occur. And even then, I still get broken into by someone on this group. So there are many reasons to post anonymously, but when someone like this person hides behind anonimity to claim they have an "official ASL FAQ" well, that is not a valid use of anonimity. Who is this person I wonder? They use AOL, so I think I know who it is. We have one person here who uses AOL, and she has been so anti-FAQ-web-site-Raffaele-and-Ric, I’m pretty sure we all know who she is. > Even more pathetic the "honest love" issue. It is like > criticizing "kind regards", as regards were supposed > to be rude! Sheer nonsense. > The good people of ASL know you and our honesty is too > appreciated to give any credibility to that pathetic > slander.

ABSOLUTELY! Those who doubt it are the same small minded souls who are always stirring the pot here. Let’s all either ignore their words or try to convert them, but none of us should return their slanders in kind. Maybe we can be a good example to them, and lead them to respond with kindness. NMB – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Be well, my friend > Kind regards > Raffaele > On Tue, 04 Jan 2000 23:26:38 GMT "ric" <asl…@XYZegroups.com> wrote: > > you know, more than a year ago this was tried and > > I succumbed and became upset, mind reading and claiming > > you know my intentions… it’s too familar and without > > credibility not to be amused… and if you do not wish > > to amuse me, then perhaps > > you should stop trying to get my attention this way > > truth is, people have their own minds and shall judge > > for themselves… and I > > wouldn’t have it any other way … here’s my entire 3 line email to you > > since you seem to have read a whole lot more than I wrote: > > pathetic and SPAM > > do it again and I’ll report you to AOL > > honest love, smiles, and hugs, ric > > that’s it… the entire email I sent to you is above in those 3 lines… your > > attempt to provoke me is pathetic… your sending unsolicited advertisements for > > your website is SPAM… your ISP defines the word, so complain to AOL… > > especially when it is a website embroiled in a two year old flame war in a > > public newsgroup… your website is the Official ASL FAQ, I assume… and your > > chosen name and posts are the only ones mentioning an ASL FAQ and obviously you > > are upsetting a couple of people here judging from their verbally violent > > opposition and condemnation of an Official ASL FAQ… > > you claim not to know me and yet you seem to judge not only my character, but my > > intentions… you can be assured of more of my silence this way… I do not > > enjoy judgmental people much especially when they admit knowing nothing about > > me… I do my best to ignore such prejudicial judges… if we have never met, > > perhaps we should keep it that way, based on your hostility and the words you > > wrote below… I still wish you peace and happiness and genuine hugs and smiles > > > > honest love, ric > — > Free audio & video emails, greeting cards and forums > Talkway – http://www.talkway.com – Talk more ways (sm)

——–== Posted Anonymously via Newsfeeds.Com ==——- Featuring the worlds only Anonymous Usenet Server ———–== http://www.newsfeeds.com ==———-

Response:

Hi ASLFAQ…… I know the frustration of being ignored when you have a valid question or request. I’ve come to the conclusion, myself, that anything regarding a resolution to the turmoil created by a few in ASL, will be ignored. Again…it’s their "ignore it and it’ll go away" mentality …. and the problem with that theory is that it does not go away no matter how long it is ignored. There are several unresolved issues that could be a tremendous help in bringing about an understanding here….but, as you can see, neither ric nor raffaele are willing to work toward a resolution of those issues. It is so simple, I don’t understand their unwillingness and refusal to recognize this. Thus, I can only conclude that to them it’s a game and they are not serious; not sincere; nor honest. I wrote a letter to both raff and ric a couple of days ago in a sincere effort. My letter was addressed to both and read: Okay guys….I’ve sat here and I’ve thought about it and pondered and I’m taking this chance of intruding upon your mailboxes to tell you that I would honestly, sincerely, like to understand about all that was said and done in the web forum previously….Help me to understand so I can put this behind me….so I can trust you. I’m really pretty good at seeing both sides of any situation…(had lots of experience in that) :-) I would like nothing better than to be able to civilly discuss certain issues that keep the barriers up between us. I want to understand each of you. I want to trust you. I can’t do this unless you are willing to talk with me and I hope you will. Sincerely, Gina Hey…I can’t get bashed for posting my own e-mail, can I ? :-) Anyway….I have not been extended the courtesy of a reply to the above letter from either of them and it was sent several days ago. Draw your own conclusions. The silence from them saddens me and the obvious rejection did hurt my feelings. It takes effort on everyone’s part to wipe a slate clean…especially a slate as dirty and muddled as the one we’re dealing with. I have done all I can do. I was really hoping that maybe I had been wrong about them….but I am now more convinced that I was right. They can play their silly games….and spread their self-serving e-mail propaganda….the truth still looms high above their deceit. Borrowing a quote from Abraham Lincoln…"You can fool all of the people some of the time, and you can fool some of the people all of the time, but you can’t fool all of the people all of time." Did I get that right ? I still believe that one day…soon….the "support" will return in full force without us having to deal with egos and childish games. And I do appreciate your efforts in trying to find the truth, too. Smiles, Gina "Seen a shooting star tonight Slip Away…. Tomorrow will be another day…" — Bob Dylan

Response:

I think your right Eddie.. the kind word is of the value when one is being persecuted, or the silliness we pursue.. honestly.. when they are getting to me.. I do appreciate someone saying.. hey lady.. it’s ok.. and just hitting them with another’s angry words makes them more nutty.. and somehow they think they are validated for the cruelty and taunting.. Thank you, I will remember your words.. Pamela "Candyman" <spoo…@banet.net> wrote in message

news:38718722.5AE04D45@banet.net… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> How does it go? - The snowball stops here???? I wish we could make it that > simple. You and many have always been there for me, more so I’m ashamed to say > than I have been for you. Knowing you are here for me indeed gives me strength > when I’m at my weakest. I don’t need to see folks fighting about me or > defending me to know they are here for me. Methinks a nice word to those > offended goes farther than a nasty word to those offending. Just a thought. > Hope this finds all well. > Brother Hugs > Eddie (Chief)

Response:

Hi, Harvey… I see you are still using WinVN, and I know you mentioned before that you liked that one… but there are a few others that are just as good, and may give you fewer problems… I have WinVN also, but haven’t used it much… NewsXpress is a simple, basic newsreader, with only a few minor quirks. I can give you a URL to download it, and it is Free… or I can send it to you, in a Zip file. The Zip file is only 263kb, so it shouldn’t be too much of a problem to download in your email. It is a good overall newsreader, and does have most of the features that the majority of posters would need, for reading and posting, decoding binaries, archiving, etc. XNews is another one, similar to NewsXpress, and has a few more features. I could give you a URL, or send that one to you also, but the Zip file is a bit larger, at 546kb. It is Free also. And of course there is Agent, which has a stripped down Free version, and several others, such as Gravity, which are available for a price. I have 6 different newsreaders, that I use for several different purposes, but as I said, NewsXpress is a good, user friendly reader, which is more than adequate, for posting to ASL… Sorry if I bored you with the info, but if I can help, just let me know. Take care, Harvey, and watch out for those Gremlins on your wing. What you need is a good "wing man"… (laugh) sincerely, Michael – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -In article <946966433.841…@Chaos.es.co.nz>, ICQ#34604382 wrote: >I wrote a reply, but the gremlins in my newsreader, attacked and I lost >my reply. ICQ me is the best way for me to answer your queries. >I can’t write another reply again, in case the gremlins attack again. >Harvey >In article <Hnfc4.4090$KY2.170893@pm02news>, asl…@XYZegroups.com says… >><snipped>

Response:

Hi Harvey… not to try to tell you what to do or anything, but what did you think of my other posts and especially the words you inspired in my responses to you? Your Name Here = Harvey wrote in message <946937567.788…@Chaos.es.co.nz>… >No.

No what?… seriously (and friendly), is this post addressing my post or speaking philosophically?… if you are suggesting or critiquing my post, I’d appreciate you doing it specifically for I don’t know which of your questions are meant specifically for me… I thought I clearly said I wished the bait and switch would stop… and then I attempted to lighten the mood by showing the ridiculousness of made-up enemies and flame wars… perhaps all the static in the NG or my imperfect writing skills obscured my point… >What was the New Year celebration about? >What was the message worldwide, on the eve of a new millenium. >Not to repeat history all over again. >There is no REAL fun in baiting, biting back, responding, etc, >continuing unto infinity the same old stuff – all of it negative.

this is what I said… and have been saying… I appreciate your support… >Remain truthful to alt.support.loneliness – >No, it doesn’t have to be dead serious, with no joking.

I agree… the question, it seems, is who’s sense of humor shall decide what is acceptable humor and who’s sense of humor shall be repressed… shall it be the loudest voice?… the angriest?… the most hateful?… the best faux-victim?… which of us claims the right to decide what is right or wrong in this group?… I certainly don’t… >But don’t use jokes that fall flat, or are only for your OWN entertainment.

humor is about taking risks… of the billions of people in this world, there are several hundred – just several hundred stand up commedians… that’s it… and some people find some commedians hysterically funny and other people find the same commedians either terribly offensive or painfully boring… humor is subjective… and much of it fails… shall we be afraid to fail?… I think that is why many are lonely… afraid to reach out… afraid of rejection… afraid of offending or making a mistake… it’s obvious a few people in this group want to run the show here… impossible… especially the way they are going about it… and I hope you’re do not ask me to be perfect or a saint… I am not… I will sometimes laugh at the unprovoked negativity aimed at me to release my frustration with it, rather than hold in the frustration until I become angry… I’m not going to let this support group become unhealthy for me… the negativity does not have enough credibility for me to take it seriously enough to become angry over it… but sometimes, laughter eases the frustration of facing unprovoked hostility in a support group virtually every day… I’ve been silent for a long time, after all… >That others may find offensive. If you have any judgement – use it.

and I do… I suggest all of us do… the same standards for everyone… there are no bulls here who can not control themselves when a red flag is waved… >If in doubt, leave it out – and if the same people keep on disliking it, >please respect their wishes.

who’s wishes Harvey?… some want me to leave this group… shall I respect their wishes and leave?… some want to send unprovoked hostility at me every chance they get… shall I respect their wishes and have no right to respond if I want to or simply vent a little in a support group?… I welcome anyone to walk a few days here in my shoes and tell me what they’d do… >Being truthful always, is what really life is about. And not being only >truthful when it suits you.

I am truthful, always… lies or any pretense that is not an open role playing game offends me… hypocrisy offends me… it’s a challenge for me to remain silent when I am directly confronted by hypocrisy or injustice… >There is no honest love, just love.

please explain this one… have a problem with my signature?… >There is only one kind of love, >and that is the genuine article. When you give love, you don’t expect >anything in return – love really has no strings attached. >Any strings [like in a relationship between a man and woman] is voluntarily >tied and respected there.

agreed… don’t see how this applies to me… if you think it does, please explain… >I don’t really need to write the above, because you should know inside, >all this stuff anyway. >There is a conscience in each one of us, and we should listen to it. >If you want to end the negativity – you don’t keep on perpetuating >it. Why add anymore to that snowball rolling down the hill.

that’s what every post I’ve written addressing the negativity has been saying… perhaps you have not understood what I’ve intended to say in my words… perhaps the ranting flames and insults have effectively distorted the truth… I’ll happily discuss the meaning of any of my words with you if you have any concerns or questions about them… hopefully we’ll be fair and place everyone under the same scrutiny… >Harvey

thanks for your support… and perhaps some criticism, but with all due respect I am not sure which of your criticism specifically refers to me… so I ask for clarification if you feel it does… I’m usualy very open to positive critique and welcome it… I love to learn how to actualize my ideals better than I do… and I hope to hear from you in more positive threads too honest love, ric "There’s a sign on the wall, but she wants to be sure, Cause you know sometimes words have two meanings… " ~ Led Zeppelin ~ – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->In article <1I5c4.4017$KY2.158227@pm02news>, asl…@XYZegroups.com says… >>Z-ark-of-the-covenant: of course >>mathematicians, sheesh :} >>your penchance for dotting every i and crossing every t is quite infuriating >to >>those who slipped and crossed lines they tell others not to cross… >>pardon me whilst I bark at you a bit… friends are allowed, right? >>they bait, you bite… you bait, they bite… that’s not support and you know >>it, so you’re undermining your credibility by biting back and baiting back… >>who starts doesn’t matter, it’s pretty obvious where the venom is really >coming >>from… but if you join the bait switch game you lose credibility… your >words >>to me, remember? >>seriously, I wish you’d stop taking the bait… and I wish you’d stop >>retaliating… you only undermine yourself when you do… the best response is >>to ignore – your words…

Response:

Unicorn wrote in message … >I think your right Eddie.. >the kind word is of the value when one is being persecuted, >or the silliness we pursue.. honestly.. when they are getting to me.. >I do appreciate someone saying.. hey lady.. it’s ok.. and just hitting them >with another’s angry words makes them more nutty.. >and somehow they think they are validated for the cruelty and taunting.. >Thank you, I will remember your words.. >Pamela

and I will remember yours… Eddie’s too I’m happy I returned to this newsgroup… I missed it many times during 1999… and I remember the wonderful posts and inspirations and friends I’ve met here… heck, I still hear from friends I met here in 1997 even though I was virtually incommunicato except for my web page updates all through last year… my life has been enriched by my sharing and ASL has been sme of the best sharing I’ve experieced… I look forward to sharing with new friends I am finding here too honest love, ric ~ life is so much sweeter when we are sweet – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->"Candyman" <spoo…@banet.net> wrote in message >news:38718722.5AE04D45@banet.net… >> How does it go? - The snowball stops here???? I wish we could make it >that >> simple. You and many have always been there for me, more so I’m ashamed >to say >> than I have been for you. Knowing you are here for me indeed gives me >strength >> when I’m at my weakest. I don’t need to see folks fighting about me or >> defending me to know they are here for me. Methinks a nice word to those >> offended goes farther than a nasty word to those offending. Just a >thought. >> Hope this finds all well. >> Brother Hugs >> Eddie (Chief)

Response:

In article <946966433.841…@Chaos.es.co.nz>, kiwilove_nospample…@es.co.nz (Your Name Here = Harvey) writes: >I wrote a reply, but the gremlins in my newsreader, attacked and I lost >my reply. ICQ me is the best way for me to answer your queries. >I can’t write another reply again, in case the gremlins attack again. >Harvey

Hey Harvey …. You have gremlins, too ???!!!! I wonder if your gremlins are related to my gremlins. ;-) Mine are always playing pranks on me and causing my computer to do weird things. Doesn’t it make you crazy to have a nice long post all written out and those mangy little gremlins snatch it up and eat it ? Hugs and Smiles, Gina "Seen a shooting star tonight Slip Away…. Tomorrow will be another day…" — Bob Dylan

Response:

In article <Hnfc4.4090$KY2.170893@pm02news>, "ric" <asl…@XYZegroups.com> writes: – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->Hi Harvey… not to try to tell you what to do or anything, but what did you >think of my other posts and especially the words you inspired in my responses >to >you? >Your Name Here = Harvey wrote in message <946937567.788…@Chaos.es.co.nz>… >>No. >No what?… seriously (and friendly), is this post addressing my post or >speaking >philosophically?… if you are suggesting or critiquing my post, I’d >appreciate >you doing it specifically for I don’t know which of your questions are meant >specifically for me… >I thought I clearly said I wished the bait and switch would stop… and then >I >attempted to lighten the mood by showing the ridiculousness of made-up >enemies >and flame wars… perhaps all the static in the NG or my imperfect writing >skills obscured my point… >>What was the New Year celebration about? >>What was the message worldwide, on the eve of a new millenium. >>Not to repeat history all over again. >>There is no REAL fun in baiting, biting back, responding, etc, >>continuing unto infinity the same old stuff – all of it negative. >this is what I said… and have been saying… I appreciate your support… >>Remain truthful to alt.support.loneliness – >>No, it doesn’t have to be dead serious, with no joking.

<snip> Wait a minute….I’m confused. I didn’t see Harvey’s message addressed to "ric" — Did I miss something ? Gina "Seen a shooting star tonight Slip Away…. Tomorrow will be another day…" — Bob Dylan

Response:

>>There is no honest love, just love. >please explain this one… have a problem with my signature?…

Ric, when you use that signature right after being offensive, you make yourself out to be a hypocrite. Go ahead and ignore me, ric. The facts are out in the open: You bullied me, and I called you on it. And with your silence, you pretend to be making a statement against anonymous posters! Well, if I was a blatant flamer, I’d agree. But I had never said anything offensive to anyone in this ng, including you. You threatened me in my private email for some unknown reason, and now that I brought it out in the open, you use the flimsy excuse of my anon name to not answer. You have shown your true colors to everyone, ric. I guess I’m not surprised that you couldn’t come up with an honest answer that would require true strength of character. I suppose I’m better off with nothing, rather than have to try to read through another one of your long pages of hypocritical, self-centered essays. My name may be anonymous, but I am very real, and I have grown to love this group. But now I understand what so many people were complaining about when news of your "Second Coming" hit the ng. It’s simple, in my opinion. What you did was hurtful and uncalled for, and I will never see "honest anything" in your words from now on. I hope others will beware of your sweet signature line. -ASLFAQ

Response:

I wrote a reply, but the gremlins in my newsreader, attacked and I lost my reply. ICQ me is the best way for me to answer your queries. I can’t write another reply again, in case the gremlins attack again. Harvey In article <Hnfc4.4090$KY2.170893@pm02news>, asl…@XYZegroups.com says… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->Hi Harvey… not to try to tell you what to do or anything, but what did you >think of my other posts and especially the words you inspired in my responses to >you? >Your Name Here = Harvey wrote in message <946937567.788…@Chaos.es.co.nz>… >>No. >No what?… seriously (and friendly), is this post addressing my post or >speaking >philosophically?… if you are suggesting or critiquing my post, I’d appreciate >you doing it specifically for I don’t know which of your questions are meant >specifically for me… >I thought I clearly said I wished the bait and switch would stop… and then I >attempted to lighten the mood by showing the ridiculousness of made-up enemies >and flame wars… perhaps all the static in the NG or my imperfect writing >skills obscured my point… >>What was the New Year celebration about? >>What was the message worldwide, on the eve of a new millenium. >>Not to repeat history all over again. >>There is no REAL fun in baiting, biting back, responding, etc, >>continuing unto infinity the same old stuff – all of it negative. >this is what I said… and have been saying… I appreciate your support… >>Remain truthful to alt.support.loneliness – >>No, it doesn’t have to be dead serious, with no joking. >I agree… the question, it seems, is who’s sense of humor shall decide what is >acceptable humor and who’s sense of humor shall be repressed… shall it be the >loudest voice?… the angriest?… the most hateful?… the best faux-victim?… >which of us claims the right to decide what is right or wrong in this group?… >I certainly don’t… >>But don’t use jokes that fall flat, or are only for your OWN entertainment. >humor is about taking risks… of the billions of people in this world, there >are several hundred – just several hundred stand up commedians… that’s it… >and some people find some commedians hysterically funny and other people find >the same commedians either terribly offensive or painfully boring… humor is >subjective… and much of it fails… >shall we be afraid to fail?… I think that is why many are lonely… afraid to >reach out… afraid of rejection… afraid of offending or making a mistake… >it’s obvious a few people in this group want to run the show here… >impossible… especially the way they are going about it… >and I hope you’re do not ask me to be perfect or a saint… I am not… I will >sometimes laugh at the unprovoked negativity aimed at me to release my >frustration with it, rather than hold in the frustration until I become angry… >I’m not going to let this support group become unhealthy for me… >the negativity does not have enough credibility for me to take it seriously >enough to become angry over it… but sometimes, laughter eases the frustration >of facing unprovoked hostility in a support group virtually every day… I’ve >been silent for a long time, after all… >>That others may find offensive. If you have any judgement – use it. >and I do… I suggest all of us do… the same standards for everyone… there >are no bulls here who can not control themselves when a red flag is waved… >>If in doubt, leave it out – and if the same people keep on disliking it, >>please respect their wishes. >who’s wishes Harvey?… some want me to leave this group… shall I respect >their wishes and leave?… some want to send unprovoked hostility at me every >chance they get… shall I respect their wishes and have no right to respond if >I want to or simply vent a little in a support group?… >I welcome anyone to walk a few days here in my shoes and tell me what they’d >do… >>Being truthful always, is what really life is about. And not being only >>truthful when it suits you. >I am truthful, always… lies or any pretense that is not an open role playing >game offends me… hypocrisy offends me… it’s a challenge for me to remain >silent when I am directly confronted by hypocrisy or injustice… >>There is no honest love, just love. >please explain this one… have a problem with my signature?… >>There is only one kind of love, >>and that is the genuine article. When you give love, you don’t expect >>anything in return – love really has no strings attached. >>Any strings [like in a relationship between a man and woman] is voluntarily >>tied and respected there. >agreed… don’t see how this applies to me… if you think it does, please >explain… >>I don’t really need to write the above, because you should know inside, >>all this stuff anyway. >>There is a conscience in each one of us, and we should listen to it. >>If you want to end the negativity – you don’t keep on perpetuating >>it. Why add anymore to that snowball rolling down the hill. >that’s what every post I’ve written addressing the negativity has been saying… >perhaps you have not understood what I’ve intended to say in my words… perhaps >the ranting flames and insults have effectively distorted the truth… I’ll >happily discuss the meaning of any of my words with you if you have any concerns >or questions about them… hopefully we’ll be fair and place everyone under the >same scrutiny… >>Harvey >thanks for your support… and perhaps some criticism, but with all due respect >I am not sure which of your criticism specifically refers to me… so I ask for >clarification if you feel it does… I’m usualy very open to positive critique >and welcome it… I love to learn how to actualize my ideals better than I do… >and I hope to hear from you in more positive threads too >honest love, ric >"There’s a sign on the wall, but she wants to be sure, >Cause you know sometimes words have two meanings… " > ~ Led Zeppelin ~ >>In article <1I5c4.4017$KY2.158227@pm02news>, asl…@XYZegroups.com says… >>>Z-ark-of-the-covenant: of course >>>mathematicians, sheesh :} >>>your penchance for dotting every i and crossing every t is quite infuriating >>to >>>those who slipped and crossed lines they tell others not to cross… >>>pardon me whilst I bark at you a bit… friends are allowed, right? >>>they bait, you bite… you bait, they bite… that’s not support and you know >>>it, so you’re undermining your credibility by biting back and baiting back… >>>who starts doesn’t matter, it’s pretty obvious where the venom is really >>coming >>>from… but if you join the bait switch game you lose credibility… your >>words >>>to me, remember? >>>seriously, I wish you’d stop taking the bait… and I wish you’d stop >>>retaliating… you only undermine yourself when you do… the best response is >>>to ignore – your words…

Response:

Thank you, Harvey… very, very, well spoken… and I agree, this is not meant to be a humorless place, for I believe the laughter is just as important as the tears… they are both needed, and both serve very important needs within us… As you noted, there is a big difference in joking about the dances of disco, or telling of a silly blunder we have made… .. and laughing at the pain, and at the expense, of others… There is a big difference in laughing *with* someone, and laughing *at* someone… Yes, I am guilty of responding to the ridicule, and taunting, when I should be silent, but I am only human, and I make mistakes… but on the other hand, I think it is important for all of the people that truly, sincerely need this group, active posters, as well as those who only choose to read, to not allow lies to stand, and not to allow ridicule to go completely unchallenged… if for no other reason, than to show those that wish to come here and speak from their hearts, openly, and honestly, that they will not stand alone, if they become the target of attacks, ridicule, parody, and harm… I will do my best to ignore the trolls, and the taunts and the ridicule… I will do my best not to add to the speed of that snowball, but I will not simply allow it to roll over my friends, or myself… and I will not ignore those that would intentionally harm others, that may be too vulnerable, and too wounded, to defend themselves… Thank you again, Harvey, for your insightful words, and for being here with us… I wish you well, and I wish you Peace… sincerely, Michael – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -In article <946937567.788…@Chaos.es.co.nz>, ICQ#34604382 wrote: >No. >What was the New Year celebration about? >What was the message worldwide, on the eve of a new millenium. >Not to repeat history all over again. >There is no REAL fun in baiting, biting back, responding, etc, >continuing unto infinity the same old stuff – all of it negative. >Remain truthful to alt.support.loneliness – >No, it doesn’t have to be dead serious, with no joking. >But don’t use jokes that fall flat, or are only for your OWN entertainment. >That others may find offensive. If you have any judgement – use it. >If in doubt, leave it out – and if the same people keep on disliking it, >please respect their wishes. >Being truthful always, is what really life is about. And not being only >truthful when it suits you. >There is no honest love, just love. There is only one kind of love, >and that is the genuine article. When you give love, you don’t expect >anything in return – love really has no strings attached. >Any strings [like in a relationship between a man and woman] is voluntarily >tied and respected there. >I don’t really need to write the above, because you should know inside, >all this stuff anyway. >There is a conscience in each one of us, and we should listen to it. >If you want to end the negativity – you don’t keep on perpetuating >it. Why add anymore to that snowball rolling down the hill. >Harvey

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Maddogg wrote: > Thank you, Harvey… very, very, well spoken… and I agree, > this is not meant to be a humorless place, for I believe the > laughter is just as important as the tears… they are both > needed, and both serve very important needs within us… > As you noted, there is a big difference in joking about the > dances of disco, or telling of a silly blunder we have made… > .. and laughing at the pain, and at the expense, of others… > There is a big difference in laughing *with* someone, and > laughing *at* someone… > Yes, I am guilty of responding to the ridicule, and taunting, > when I should be silent, but I am only human, and I make > mistakes… but on the other hand, I think it is important for > all of the people that truly, sincerely need this group, active > posters, as well as those who only choose to read, to not > allow lies to stand, and not to allow ridicule to go completely > unchallenged… if for no other reason, than to show those > that wish to come here and speak from their hearts, openly, > and honestly, that they will not stand alone, if they become > the target of attacks, ridicule, parody, and harm… > I will do my best to ignore the trolls, and the taunts and the > ridicule… I will do my best not to add to the speed of that > snowball, but I will not simply allow it to roll over my friends, > or myself… and I will not ignore those that would intentionally > harm others, that may be too vulnerable, and too wounded, > to defend themselves… > Thank you again, Harvey, for your insightful words, and for > being here with us… I wish you well, and I wish you Peace… > sincerely, > Michael > In article <946937567.788…@Chaos.es.co.nz>, ICQ#34604382 wrote: > >No. > >What was the New Year celebration about? > >What was the message worldwide, on the eve of a new millenium. > >Not to repeat history all over again. > >There is no REAL fun in baiting, biting back, responding, etc, > >continuing unto infinity the same old stuff – all of it negative. > >Remain truthful to alt.support.loneliness – > >No, it doesn’t have to be dead serious, with no joking. > >But don’t use jokes that fall flat, or are only for your OWN entertainment. > >That others may find offensive. If you have any judgement – use it. > >If in doubt, leave it out – and if the same people keep on disliking it, > >please respect their wishes. > >Being truthful always, is what really life is about. And not being only > >truthful when it suits you. > >There is no honest love, just love. There is only one kind of love, > >and that is the genuine article. When you give love, you don’t expect > >anything in return – love really has no strings attached. > >Any strings [like in a relationship between a man and woman] is voluntarily > >tied and respected there. > >I don’t really need to write the above, because you should know inside, > >all this stuff anyway. > >There is a conscience in each one of us, and we should listen to it. > >If you want to end the negativity – you don’t keep on perpetuating > >it. Why add anymore to that snowball rolling down the hill. > >Harvey

How does it go? - The snowball stops here???? I wish we could make it that simple. You and many have always been there for me, more so I’m ashamed to say than I have been for you. Knowing you are here for me indeed gives me strength when I’m at my weakest. I don’t need to see folks fighting about me or defending me to know they are here for me. Methinks a nice word to those offended goes farther than a nasty word to those offending. Just a thought. Hope this finds all well. Brother Hugs Eddie (Chief)

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Rainbow Knight wrote: > For example, when I’ve read of the legion of emails > supposedly send by my friends, coworkers and students > (perhaps also the administrators? or some fellows in > the neighboring universities? a few librarians? > some bar-tenders? or bar-hards?), I’ve tried to > figure out the whole scenario. > Some of them must also have returned from holidays > in anticipation: > "Hurry up, hurry up, Pamail waits for our letters!" > Others have bought a computer on the spot. > "No matter the price, but it *must* be able to read > ASL!" > Furthermore, all should have learned in a few days > more English than in the rest of their lifes, to > communicate with the smartherapistic pamchologist > about my character (or lack thereof?) and discuss > my repulsive posting habits. > Finally, the students are supposed to be so > self-less to give priority to the pammail > rather than to some more obvious needs. > Kind of funny, kay? Got it?

Hilarious! NMB ——–== Posted Anonymously via Newsfeeds.Com ==——- Featuring the worlds only Anonymous Usenet Server ———–== http://www.newsfeeds.com ==———-

Response:

How about you stop the "games" altogether, ric… it makes me really sad, that you think there is humor in all of the intentional pain that raffaele has caused others, and that all of the disruption he has caused in this group, is some kind of a game, or a joke… I don’t find the harm done to this group, and all of the pain caused to my friends, is in the least bit funny… honest contempt, Michael In article <1I5c4.4017$KY2.158227@pm02news>, "ric" <asl…@XYZegroups.com> wrote: <snipped> – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->oh yes, so as I was saying… can we play another game now?… <snipped> >honest wars, ric

Response:

In article <1I5c4.4017$KY2.158227@pm02news>, "ric" <asl…@XYZegroups.com> writes: – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->Subject: Fantasy Wars (was: Re: Fantasy accusations /Was: Hi y’all!) >From: "ric" <asl…@XYZegroups.com> >Date: Mon, 03 Jan 2000 18:16:29 GMT >Z-ark-of-the-covenant: of course >mathematicians, sheesh :} >your penchance for dotting every i and crossing every t is quite infuriating >to >those who slipped and crossed lines they tell others not to cross… >pardon me whilst I bark at you a bit… friends are allowed, right? >they bait, you bite… you bait, they bite… that’s not support and you know >it, so you’re undermining your credibility by biting back and baiting back… >who starts doesn’t matter, it’s pretty obvious where the venom is really >coming >from… but if you join the bait switch game you lose credibility… your >words >to me, remember? >seriously, I wish you’d stop taking the bait… and I wish you’d stop >retaliating… you only undermine yourself when you do… the best response >is >to ignore – your words… >you know you have every right to hold up a mirror to every person who >mentions >your name in any way shape or form… maybe if people would realize that is >precisely what you do much of the time (not nearly to say your perfect and >don’t >cross the line yourself sometimes… Pamela crossed the line, I saw… your >rapid fire retaliation just lends credibility to the negativity written about >you… nobody’s p[erfect, I cross the line too... ummmm, I'm crossing the >line >now, aren't I?... ooops)... >what was I saying?... oh yes, if the price of tea in Italy goes down any >more, >the British might move there and then what?... you'll be teaching Italian >mathematics to people who speak English and who knows what sorts of letters >English speaking students might write... it's very good that so many of your >Itlalian students can write English though, you must be a very good >teacher... >there's a point in here somewhere, but dang if I'll find it... >oh yes, so as I was saying... can we play another game now?... no wait... >better >yet, let's start a new war and choose up different sides just to make it more >interesting... I'll fight with you and Chloe (ready Chloe?)... ummm, since >you >have two people on your side it's my turn to choose the next person on my >side >so I'll choose <scanning the newsgroup for likely victims>... OTS... yes, I >need >someone who's gonna make my jubberish look like it makes sense (oh please be >laughing out there, I'm trying so hard to be funny >your turn >honest wars, ric

Hmmmm....this looks familiar....make the instigator appear as the victim...and..... Let's pretend that all the damage ever done by the instigator, now portrayed as the victim, was just a figment of everyone's imagination. Let's trivialize all the hurt and damage and make everyone feel stupid for even thinking about it....much less speaking out about it. But...I have to give you credit, ric. You tried very hard to clean up after raff...I hope he appreciates your friendship. Gina "Seen a shooting star tonight Slip Away.... Tomorrow will be another day..." --- Bob Dylan

Response:

>Hilarious! >NMB

Sorry guys....I fail to see the humor. Maybe one of you can explain it for me. Gina

Response:

No. What was the New Year celebration about? What was the message worldwide, on the eve of a new millenium. Not to repeat history all over again. There is no REAL fun in baiting, biting back, responding, etc, continuing unto infinity the same old stuff - all of it negative. Remain truthful to alt.support.loneliness - No, it doesn't have to be dead serious, with no joking. But don't use jokes that fall flat, or are only for your OWN entertainment. That others may find offensive. If you have any judgement - use it. If in doubt, leave it out - and if the same people keep on disliking it, please respect their wishes. Being truthful always, is what really life is about. And not being only truthful when it suits you. There is no honest love, just love. There is only one kind of love, and that is the genuine article. When you give love, you don't expect anything in return - love really has no strings attached. Any strings [like in a relationship between a man and woman] is voluntarily tied and respected there. I don’t really need to write the above, because you should know inside, all this stuff anyway. There is a conscience in each one of us, and we should listen to it. If you want to end the negativity – you don’t keep on perpetuating it. Why add anymore to that snowball rolling down the hill. Harvey In article <1I5c4.4017$KY2.158227@pm02news>, asl…@XYZegroups.com says… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->Z-ark-of-the-covenant: of course >mathematicians, sheesh :} >your penchance for dotting every i and crossing every t is quite infuriating to >those who slipped and crossed lines they tell others not to cross… >pardon me whilst I bark at you a bit… friends are allowed, right? >they bait, you bite… you bait, they bite… that’s not support and you know >it, so you’re undermining your credibility by biting back and baiting back… >who starts doesn’t matter, it’s pretty obvious where the venom is really coming >from… but if you join the bait switch game you lose credibility… your words >to me, remember? >seriously, I wish you’d stop taking the bait… and I wish you’d stop >retaliating… you only undermine yourself when you do… the best response is >to ignore – your words… >you know you have every right to hold up a mirror to every person who mentions >your name in any way shape or form… maybe if people would realize that is >precisely what you do much of the time (not nearly to say your perfect and don’t >cross the line yourself sometimes… Pamela crossed the line, I saw… your >rapid fire retaliation just lends credibility to the negativity written about >you… nobody’s p[erfect, I cross the line too… ummmm, I’m crossing the line >now, aren’t I?… ooops)… >what was I saying?… oh yes, if the price of tea in Italy goes down any more, >the British might move there and then what?… you’ll be teaching Italian >mathematics to people who speak English and who knows what sorts of letters >English speaking students might write… it’s very good that so many of your >Itlalian students can write English though, you must be a very good teacher… >there’s a point in here somewhere, but dang if I’ll find it… >oh yes, so as I was saying… can we play another game now?… no wait… better >yet, let’s start a new war and choose up different sides just to make it more >interesting… I’ll fight with you and Chloe (ready Chloe?)… ummm, since you >have two people on your side it’s my turn to choose the next person on my side >so I’ll choose <scanning the newsgroup for likely victims>… OTS… yes, I need >someone who’s gonna make my jubberish look like it makes sense (oh please be >laughing out there, I’m trying so hard to be funny >your turn >honest wars, ric >Rainbow Knight wrote in message ><3HXb4.23658$Mg.345…@c01read03-admin.service.talkway.com>… >>x-no-archive: yes >>On Sun, 02 Jan 2000 19:55:55 -0600 poet <p…@asarian-host.org> wrote: >>> x-no-archive: yes >>> There are several who don’t want anything to do with any >>> of this and are afraid to post about anything intimate or >>> personal because of all the fighting/accusations/what >>> have you. Who can feel "safe" in this atmosphere? And >>> everyone is equally guilty of contributing to it, including >>> myself, I suppose. >>> There is no reason to continue this. Everyone knows how all >>> of the principals feel. Everyone can decide what s/he thinks >>> for her/himself. >>> It should end here and now. "I will fight no more forever." >>> But, alas, it probably won’t. >>Wise words, especially the last reflexion on human >>nature. There is only to notice that those who stoop >>so low as to invent fantasy accusations are but a >>minority. >>For example, a jerk who invented to get email from >>coworkers and students of mine. Hilarious! >>It could be enough to ignore them and to >>see the general athmosphere to be improved. >>Best wishes >>Raffaele

Response:

Z-ark-of-the-covenant: of course mathematicians, sheesh :} your penchance for dotting every i and crossing every t is quite infuriating to those who slipped and crossed lines they tell others not to cross… pardon me whilst I bark at you a bit… friends are allowed, right? they bait, you bite… you bait, they bite… that’s not support and you know it, so you’re undermining your credibility by biting back and baiting back… who starts doesn’t matter, it’s pretty obvious where the venom is really coming from… but if you join the bait switch game you lose credibility… your words to me, remember? seriously, I wish you’d stop taking the bait… and I wish you’d stop retaliating… you only undermine yourself when you do… the best response is to ignore – your words… you know you have every right to hold up a mirror to every person who mentions your name in any way shape or form… maybe if people would realize that is precisely what you do much of the time (not nearly to say your perfect and don’t cross the line yourself sometimes… Pamela crossed the line, I saw… your rapid fire retaliation just lends credibility to the negativity written about you… nobody’s p[erfect, I cross the line too… ummmm, I’m crossing the line now, aren’t I?… ooops)… what was I saying?… oh yes, if the price of tea in Italy goes down any more, the British might move there and then what?… you’ll be teaching Italian mathematics to people who speak English and who knows what sorts of letters English speaking students might write… it’s very good that so many of your Itlalian students can write English though, you must be a very good teacher… there’s a point in here somewhere, but dang if I’ll find it… oh yes, so as I was saying… can we play another game now?… no wait… better yet, let’s start a new war and choose up different sides just to make it more interesting… I’ll fight with you and Chloe (ready Chloe?)… ummm, since you have two people on your side it’s my turn to choose the next person on my side so I’ll choose <scanning the newsgroup for likely victims>… OTS… yes, I need someone who’s gonna make my jubberish look like it makes sense (oh please be laughing out there, I’m trying so hard to be funny your turn honest wars, ric Rainbow Knight wrote in message

<3HXb4.23658$Mg.345…@c01read03-admin.service.talkway.com>… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->x-no-archive: yes >On Sun, 02 Jan 2000 19:55:55 -0600 poet <p…@asarian-host.org> wrote: >> x-no-archive: yes >> There are several who don’t want anything to do with any >> of this and are afraid to post about anything intimate or >> personal because of all the fighting/accusations/what >> have you. Who can feel "safe" in this atmosphere? And >> everyone is equally guilty of contributing to it, including >> myself, I suppose. >> There is no reason to continue this. Everyone knows how all >> of the principals feel. Everyone can decide what s/he thinks >> for her/himself. >> It should end here and now. "I will fight no more forever." >> But, alas, it probably won’t. >Wise words, especially the last reflexion on human >nature. There is only to notice that those who stoop >so low as to invent fantasy accusations are but a >minority. >For example, a jerk who invented to get email from >coworkers and students of mine. Hilarious! >It could be enough to ignore them and to >see the general athmosphere to be improved. >Best wishes >Raffaele

Response:

Z-fantasy-pirul

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