what women really want

Question:

If it took you ten years, it is definitely your time – time to figure out why it took you ten years to end an abusive marriage, or why you were unable to work it out. Best of luck – all you have to work on is you. Your daughter makes it worthwhile as a venture. Tim

Response:

OK,…….where does that put me? I wear Converse All Star (Chucks), Winter, Spring, Summer, Fall. Dress, black. Casual, off white. That’s right folks, I own and wear two pair of canvas hi-top basketball shoes. When the soles fall off, I replace ‘em. ‘Cept when I’m ice fishin’,…then I borrow my dad’s swampers. Does that make me odd? CJ da Yooper

Well, it’s one of many things <G I own a pair of Doc Martins, a pair of winter boots and when the weather warms up I’ll pick up a new pair of tennis shoes. But then I’m probably weird too. Joseph — ILLEGITIMI NON CARBORUNDUM

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Often women SAY that they want a caring and sensitive man but DATE the "bad boys", half the time they even MARRY the "bad boys"!!!! Only to have things fall apart and wind up divorced! Unfortunately, women need to learn the impact of their choices not only on their immediate circumstances, but also on society in general! When they continue to say one thing and do another, they are sending a few choice and VERY CLEAR messages to all of us men! Also infortunately, the femminists are NOT LIKELY to be the ones to help women learn this FACT! For example femmisits would likely be aghast at the behaviour of men if a scantilly clad woman were to pass by. They would likely attack such men for being "pigs" or "Chauvanists". But I have not seen many femminists who would admit that the woman is at least partly responsible for the situation by dressing provocatively! WOMEN MAKE CHOICES! And they are certainly intelligent enough to evaluate the impact that their choices are likely to have! I have NO SYMAPTHY for a woman who dresses "HOT" and then complains about all the attention she gets! And this kind of crap happens all the time. Sorry gals. If you want a caring and sensitive man, then you are going to have to ACT ACCORDINGLY! And I can say this because I gave up on chasing after the "hot blonde" type of women years ago! I have learned the true value of women and I hold great love and respect for them! I’m tired of trying to get the attention of women who would not give me the time of day because I didn’t have a "hard body", or a Gucci suit, or a Porche, or a six figure salary, etc… And despite all of my love, caring, senitivity, and insight it is still too self-involved, or even selfish, or too materialistic. The older women are by and large either married and involved in bad realtionships which are doomed, or are divorced and have so much bitterness and so many issues to resolve that they are not "available" or ready for a "real" relationship!!!! How’s THAT for a sick twist of fate! All I can say is the wait is long and lonely. The only consolation is that when you DO find a woman who you can connect with, it is definitely worth the wait!

Sounds like you just haven’t met the right woman yet. But when you do, please PLEASE don’t let her slip away!! Let her KNOW how you feel, and never take anything for granted in your relationship….

Response:

…and sometimes a man just wants to have sex without the stings attached

And who can blame him? Being stung during sex sounds rather painful. That’s why I stay away from bees, hornets, wasps and other stinging critters. Barb

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Sometimes a woman just needs to be touched without that sexual hint to it. …and sometimes a man just wants to have sex without the stings attached….conversation, phone call, etc. Some men can’t seem to draw the line between comfort, and jsut signs of affection. Everything has to end in SEX for them.. ….ahh….for the most part, if given the choice….. it’s preferred… Is there not one man out there woho likes to be romanitc withoUT having sex right away? Yes,…….if you’re including the impotent and comatose. It’s completely natural for a healthy fit virile man to engage in displays of affection, compassion, and support….that ultimately give rise (so to speak) to his natural sensual instincts, desires, inclinations, tendencies, etc. and so forth. It’s just that some men are better at others in in recognizing the moment, sensing/determining what’s appropriate, and repressing their nature. In case you did not know….we (men) only think about sex 1,842 separate moments every day. Do the math. In fact, flip your point around…..and you should see it’s unrealistic for a woman to expect a man to provide an aspect of intimacy, namely affection/compassion and not have that possibly conjure up a man’s sensual/sexual nature…just as it’s unrealisitc for a man to expect to be able to have sex with a woman and not have communication afterwards. Expect strings to be attached to most things….seek nothing more than compassion from a man…and if you’re lucky….you’re going to wind up with a stiff penis or a very disciplined man able to repress his nature. A lot of women consider this a win either way. Andrew

Response:

Wow. I thought it was: Dressy, walking around in, running. Must be those crossed chromosomes. 3 pair shoes per X? — Robert Grumbine http://www.radix.net/~bobg/ Science faqs and amateur activities notes and links. Sagredo (Galileo Galilei) "You present these recondite matters with too much evidence and ease; this great facility makes them less appreciated than they would be had they been presented in a more abstruse manner." Two New Sciences

Response:

No, I think it’s more like 2 pairs of shoes (one dressy, one comfy) per temperature level: hot, mild, and bloody-f*ing cold. —– Kathryn Litherland | People make their own history Latin American Studies Program | but they do not make it under University of Illinois, Chicago | circumstances of their own choosing | –Karl Marx, _The 18th Brumaire_

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I red Glosette’s post and do agree with it in general. However she has left out a possibility which, although hard to face, you must consider. Your situation sounds VERY similar to mine. And in the end I came to realize that my wife was VERY ABUSIVE towards me. Everything was about her, what she wanted (or didn’t want – read:SEX of any kind), when she wanted things, etc. Nothing I could ever do was good enough, big enough, or quick enough! And I mean NOTHING! She was constantly keeping me in a state of walking on eggshells as a means of controlling and manipulating my behaviour. I NEVER HAD "ME" TIME! I held down two jobs, and did the car repairs, the house repairs and improvements, the cooking, the laundry, the vacuuming, took care of the dogs and cat, maintained her computer, looked after the fish, drove her around to different functions, did the grocery shopping and meal planning, paid night. Yes, if she wanted to "talk" then she would wake me up in the middle of the night! Or if she heard a sound, I was woken up. Or if the dogs had to go out, I was woken up….. I do not have the specifics of your situation, but you need to think long and hard about the possibility that your wife was being abusive towards you. If in doubt, read the book "The Verbally Abusive Relationship" by Evans. All you need do is reverse the gender roles and see if she fits the pattern. Mine certainly did – LOUD AND CLEAR. The reason you need to understand this scenario is this: If she was abusive and manipulating you, then it is not your "fault". If this is the case, then there is NOTHING that you could have done! My ex used to complain that I never made any advances toward her (untrue by the way). So I waited a discrete amount of time and tried (not wanting to appear "obvious") and made appropraitely timed advances. And, of course, I was rejected! When I would try to kiss her she would screw her face up and turn her head away from me like kissing me was repugnant (sp?)!!! So it was damned if you do, damned if you don’t! This is the type of pattern abusers like because no mater what you do, they wind up in control! Think very carefully. I personally doubt if there is anything to save in your failed relationship. However, you might want to go to counselling FOR YOU so that you understand what caused you to choose a woman like that in the first place. Hopefully this will prevent you from choosing another one just like her (or worse) in the future.

WOW, sounds like MY ex! Although i never admitted (and still won’t) admit it WAS "abuse" becuz there were no physical battle scars…. just a lot of fear, self-doubt and low self-esteem, and exhaustion….and loneliness….

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I red Glosette’s post and do agree with it in general. However she has left out a possibility which, although hard to face, you must consider. Your situation sounds VERY similar to mine. And in the end I came to realize that my wife was VERY ABUSIVE towards me. Everything was about her, what she wanted (or didn’t want – read:SEX of any kind), when she wanted things, etc. Nothing I could ever do was good enough, big enough, or quick enough! And I mean NOTHING! She was constantly keeping me in a state of walking on eggshells as a means of controlling and manipulating my behaviour. I NEVER HAD "ME" TIME! I held down two jobs, and did the car repairs, the house repairs and improvements, the cooking, the laundry, the vacuuming, took care of the dogs and cat, maintained her computer, looked after the fish, drove her around to different functions, did the grocery shopping and meal planning, paid night. Yes, if she wanted to "talk" then she would wake me up in the middle of the night! Or if she heard a sound, I was woken up. Or if the dogs had to go out, I was woken up….. I do not have the specifics of your situation, but you need to think long and hard about the possibility that your wife was being abusive towards you. If in doubt, read the book "The Verbally Abusive Relationship" by Evans. All you need do is reverse the gender roles and see if she fits the pattern. Mine certainly did – LOUD AND CLEAR. The reason you need to understand this scenario is this: If she was abusive and manipulating you, then it is not your "fault". If this is the case, then there is NOTHING that you could have done! My ex used to complain that I never made any advances toward her (untrue by the way). So I waited a discrete amount of time and tried (not wanting to appear "obvious") and made appropraitely timed advances. And, of course, I was rejected! When I would try to kiss her she would screw her face up and turn her head away from me like kissing me was repugnant (sp?)!!! So it was damned if you do, damned if you don’t! This is the type of pattern abusers like because no mater what you do, they wind up in control! Think very carefully. I personally doubt if there is anything to save in your failed relationship. However, you might want to go to counselling FOR YOU so that you understand what caused you to choose a woman like that in the first place. Hopefully this will prevent you from choosing another one just like her (or worse) in the future. WOW, sounds like MY ex! Although i never admitted (and still won’t) admit it WAS "abuse" becuz there were no physical battle scars…. just a lot of fear, self-doubt and low self-esteem, and exhaustion….and loneliness….

Mary Lou… This was the problem I had – and doublly so because I am a man. I did not believe that what I was experiencing was abuse because I had been conditioned to believe that "women do not abuse men" [totally untrue as I found out ]. I also did not believe at that time that what I was experiencing was abuse because there were very few "physical" signs of abuse. But as Linda Evans points out in her book, the abuse usually starts small and verbal, then progresses. In my case it moved up to mind games, then horrific verbal abuse – to the point that most of even her friends would no longer associate because they were shocked at how I was being treated – even in their presence. Finally it began to move into outright physical abuse. All of this took it’s toll on me emotionally. I still wake up in cold sweats at night thinking about all this. I guess what I am trying to say is "WISE UP!" Mary Lou, if it walks like a duck, and quacks like a duck – IT’S A DUCK!!!!!!! If you were abused, then admit it to yourself! There is no shame in the admission as long as you have taken steps or will take steps to either stop the abuse or remove yourself from it and begin the journey down the road to recovery. <<<HUGS Lloyd Before you buy.

Response:

Some times Doulas all a woman wants is Dinner and the movie. And sometime When a wman wants a back rud thats all she wants. Not everything must end up win "hanky panky" Sometimes woman just want the closeness of their partners , their comfort and their warmth, a little compassion now and again. Sometimes they want to have their hands held or to cuddel WITHOUT havinbg it have to turn into sex. Sometimes a woman just needs to be touched without that sexual hint to it. If theres a problem with that then I am sorry! Some men can’t seem to draw the line between comfort, and jsut signs of affection. Everything has to end in SEX for them.. Ohh I could spit nails.. Is there not one man out there woho likes to be romanitc withoUT having sex right away?

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – my ex used to come home from work and rant and rave as soon as she walked in the door.i realized because of her stressful job she had to let off some steam.unfortunately at me and my daughter.so i would listen.i would interupt her and try to fix the problem.she wasnt interested in me trying to fix it , she just wanted me to shut up and listen..when i realized that it was too late. we had lost our love and communication.and when she asked me to do a chore or favor it had to be done now.not a minute later or tommorrow , but , now.i got that one too late too.whe she wanted me to massage her back that was all no hanky panky.yep missed that one too.when she wanted her tv time (usually lifetime ) that was her time.oops forgot about that one .when she was on the phone that was her time,my daughter couldnt remember that one either.when she wanted to go to dinner and a movie i wasnt supposed to expect a romantic ending..oops again ..i wonder why after 10 years of marriage that i coulnt figure all this out being in my own home wondering what to say or do without creating an arguement but now that im single…its my time

What women want? All I wanted in my marriage was to be thought of as a human being and not ignored and just thought of as a housekeeper who wasn’t paid. My ex never took an interest in anything I did. I rarely recall him asking how my day was. I would have liked sex more than twice a year. Loev, Poopie Pants

Response:

Hi Doug, From what you say, your wife was not interested in *your* day or how *you* felt. It appears she was very self-involved. Could be the reason that your communication broke down. It takes two to make a relationship and it looks like the scales were tipped in her favor with you walking on eggshells most of the time. You’re right – this is *your* time. Enjoy! Best, Donna – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – my ex used to come home from work and rant and rave as soon as she walked in the door.i realized because of her stressful job she had to let off some steam.unfortunately at me and my daughter.so i would listen.i would interupt her and try to fix the problem.she wasnt interested in me trying to fix it , she just wanted me to shut up and listen..when i realized that it was too late. we had lost our love and communication.and when she asked me to do a chore or favor it had to be done now.not a minute later or tommorrow , but , now.i got that one too late too.whe she wanted me to massage her back that was all no hanky panky.yep missed that one too.when she wanted her tv time (usually lifetime ) that was her time.oops forgot about that one .when she was on the phone that was her time,my daughter couldnt remember that one either.when she wanted to go to dinner and a movie i wasnt supposed to expect a romantic ending..oops again ..i wonder why after 10 years of marriage that i coulnt figure all this out being in my own home wondering what to say or do without creating an arguement but now that im single…its my time What women want? All I wanted in my marriage was to be thought of as a human being and not ignored and just thought of as a housekeeper who wasn’t paid. My ex never took an interest in anything I did. I rarely recall him asking how my day was. I would have liked sex more than twice a year. Loev, Poopie Pants

– Be thankful! Before you buy.

Response:

(isn’t that what we women are supposed to want? just watch the tv commercials!) Mary Lou (who actually prefers sex to shoes, but don’t tell anybody)

Response:

(isn’t that what we women are supposed to want? just watch the tv commercials!)

It’s kind of funny–I keep my shoes all jumbled together in a cardboard box, and one day I looked in and realized that they were *all black*. That’ll cut down on the number of pairs you need–I’ve got one pair in each of the basic styles–dressy sandals, pseudobirkenstocks, pumps, flats, tennis shoes, fashion boots, and winter boots. Most of them picked up from the Salvation Army or from the annual Humane Society mega-garage sale. —– Kathryn Litherland | People make their own history Latin American Studies Program | but they do not make it under University of Illinois, Chicago | circumstances of their own choosing | –Karl Marx, _The 18th Brumaire_

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Is there not one man out there woho likes to be romanitc withoUT having sex right away? Several of us. We seem to spend a lot of time not getting dates, however. Problem is, the guys who are very, shall we say, ‘goal directed’ are the ones who make the better impression regarding starting to date in the first place. Guys who prefer to let things develop, or not, don’t fare so well in getting a date in the first place. Yes, it’s a massive generalization and I’m well aware of those hazards. But, women, what is your ratio of guys who don’t vs. guys who do from your dating situations? And how does that compare to my observation from the guy side that it is _not_ an overwhelming majority of men who are ‘goal directed’ in that way. Still only an abstract consideration for me as I still need to get the divorce final, and to feel up to going through that mill again. But some of the memories are starting to return. — Robert Grumbine http://www.radix.net/~bobg/ Science faqs and amateur

activities notes and links. Sagredo (Galileo Galilei) "You present these recondite matters with too much evidence and ease; this great facility makes them less appreciated than they would be had they been presented in a more abstruse manner." Two New Sciences

You are quite correct. Just read Warren Farrell’s book "The Myth of Male Power". Often women SAY that they want a caring and sensitive man but DATE the "bad boys", half the time they even MARRY the "bad boys"!!!! Only to have things fall apart and wind up divorced! Unfortunately, women need to learn the impact of their choices not only on their immediate circumstances, but also on society in general! When they continue to say one thing and do another, they are sending a few choice and VERY CLEAR messages to all of us men! Also infortunately, the femminists are NOT LIKELY to be the ones to help women learn this FACT! For example femmisits would likely be aghast at the behaviour of men if a scantilly clad woman were to pass by. They would likely attack such men for being "pigs" or "Chauvanists". But I have not seen many femminists who would admit that the woman is at least partly responsible for the situation by dressing provocatively! WOMEN MAKE CHOICES! And they are certainly intelligent enough to evaluate the impact that their choices are likely to have! I have NO SYMAPTHY for a woman who dresses "HOT" and then complains about all the attention she gets! And this kind of crap happens all the time. Sorry gals. If you want a caring and sensitive man, then you are going to have to ACT ACCORDINGLY! And I can say this because I gave up on chasing after the "hot blonde" type of women years ago! I have learned the true value of women and I hold great love and respect for them! I’m tired of trying to get the attention of women who would not give me the time of day because I didn’t have a "hard body", or a Gucci suit, or a Porche, or a six figure salary, etc… And despite all of my love, caring, senitivity, and insight it is still too self-involved, or even selfish, or too materialistic. The older women are by and large either married and involved in bad realtionships which are doomed, or are divorced and have so much bitterness and so many issues to resolve that they are not "available" or ready for a "real" relationship!!!! How’s THAT for a sick twist of fate! All I can say is the wait is long and lonely. The only consolation is that when you DO find a woman who you can connect with, it is definitely worth the wait! Just my experience! Your mileage may vary! Lloyd Before you buy.

Response:

Indy… Yes there are. I know there is at least one because I am right here! For me at least, both foreplay and afterplay are at least as important (if not more important) than the act itself! Keep looking!

Oh I’m not looking. I am just fed up the XTBs mentality that saying hello in the morning or smiling at him means I want sex. It got to the point I cant have a civil conversation with him without him thinking he’s gonna get laid! (pardon my french) There have got to be more like me out there! And NO not everything has to leed to sex! But this is how most men are conditioned in our society!

Maybe but where is drummed into the heads that if you are married that it’s YOUR right to have sex and oif the wife doesn’t want it you will take it anyway! And where is it drummed in that a simple civil converstaion means "YEAH I’m gonna get lucky tonight"! Society teaches men that women’s feelings as simply one of the hurdles to be overcome in the complicated path to getting into her pants! It takes some real serious introspection, and some good role models, an open mind, and some time for a man to start to think of a woman as a "whole package" – to realize that the real value does not lie in her bossom or her crotch, but in her heart. And many men NEVER realize this.

I think you just described my xtb. As was evident after my C section when as I could hardly move the first words from his mouth were can you have sex yet. and as again was evident when he kicked me several times in my back when I was in agony (I ended up needing surgery) And when I was unable to move my lkegs all he cared about was when I would be able to have sex again. I am sure there are Guys out there who are gentel warm and woinderful men, who have feelings that go beyond whats in their pants. Who when a woman says no doesn’t berate and be little her and use verbal abuse and violence to take from her what HE wants. I am sure there are some guys who are quite considerate and cariung and loving and have patients and also know that someonetimes a hug is just a simple huig, and act of l;ove and that sex doesn’t need to follow. I’ve just had a really rotten time of things lately, and the XTB is gettinbg toi me.. I wish I could make hinm dissappear!

Response:

Is there not one man out there woho likes to be romanitc withoUT having sex right away?

Several of us. We seem to spend a lot of time not getting dates, however. Problem is, the guys who are very, shall we say, ‘goal directed’ are the ones who make the better impression regarding starting to date in the first place. Guys who prefer to let things develop, or not, don’t fare so well in getting a date in the first place. Yes, it’s a massive generalization and I’m well aware of those hazards. But, women, what is your ratio of guys who don’t vs. guys who do from your dating situations? And how does that compare to my observation from the guy side that it is _not_ an overwhelming majority of men who are ‘goal directed’ in that way. Still only an abstract consideration for me as I still need to get the divorce final, and to feel up to going through that mill again. But some of the memories are starting to return. — Robert Grumbine http://www.radix.net/~bobg/ Science faqs and amateur activities notes and links. Sagredo (Galileo Galilei) "You present these recondite matters with too much evidence and ease; this great facility makes them less appreciated than they would be had they been presented in a more abstruse manner." Two New Sciences

Response:

Sometimes a woman just needs to be touched without that sexual hint to it.

…and sometimes a man just wants to have sex without the stings attached….conversation, phone call, etc. Some men can’t seem to draw the line between comfort, and jsut signs of affection. Everything has to end in SEX for them..

….ahh….for the most part, if given the choice….. it’s preferred… Is there not one man out there woho likes to be romanitc withoUT having sex right away?

Yes,…….if you’re including the impotent and comatose. It’s completely natural for a healthy fit virile man to engage in displays of affection, compassion, and support….that ultimately give rise (so to speak) to his natural sensual instincts, desires, inclinations, tendencies, etc. and so forth. It’s just that some men are better at others in in recognizing the moment, sensing/determining what’s appropriate, and repressing their nature. In case you did not know….we (men) only think about sex 1,842 separate moments every day. Do the math. In fact, flip your point around…..and you should see it’s unrealistic for a woman to expect a man to provide an aspect of intimacy, namely affection/compassion and not have that possibly conjure up a man’s sensual/sexual nature…just as it’s unrealisitc for a man to expect to be able to have sex with a woman and not have communication afterwards. Expect strings to be attached to most things….seek nothing more than compassion from a man…and if you’re lucky….you’re going to wind up with a stiff penis or a very disciplined man able to repress his nature. A lot of women consider this a win either way. Andrew

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Some times Doulas all a woman wants is Dinner and the movie. And sometime When a wman wants a back rud thats all she wants. Not everything must end up win "hanky panky" Sometimes woman just want the closeness of their partners , their comfort and their warmth, a little compassion now and again. Sometimes they want to have their hands held or to cuddel WITHOUT havinbg it have to turn into sex. Sometimes a woman just needs to be touched without that sexual hint to it. If theres a problem with that then I am sorry! Some men can’t seem to draw the line between comfort, and jsut signs of affection. Everything has to end in SEX for them.. Ohh I could spit nails.. Is there not one man out there woho likes to be romanitc withoUT having sex right away?

I feel for you both Doug & Indy. Indy… Yes there are. I know there is at least one because I am right here! For me at least, both foreplay and afterplay are at least as important (if not more important) than the act itself! Keep looking! There have got to be more like me out there! And NO not everything has to leed to sex! But this is how most men are conditioned in our society! As programmed by society, having lots of sex with as many women as possible is MACHO! MANLY! The act itself is held above all else as the prize! Society teaches men that women’s feelings as simply one of the hurdles to be overcome in the complicated path to getting into her pants! It takes some real serious introspection, and some good role models, an open mind, and some time for a man to start to think of a woman as a "whole package" – to realize that the real value does not lie in her bossom or her crotch, but in her heart. And many men NEVER realize this. By the time they reach their 20’s, they have so much baggage that it is a wonder they can have any relationship, never mind a long term one. Need proof??? Just look at the divorce stats. That should be proof enough. And the sad part is that many women in their headlong rush for equality have unwittingly brought themselves down to this level! Further complicating maters! <sigh Doug… I red Glosette’s post and do agree with it in general. However she has left out a possibility which, although hard to face, you must consider. Your situation sounds VERY similar to mine. And in the end I came to realize that my wife was VERY ABUSIVE towards me. Everything was about her, what she wanted (or didn’t want – read:SEX of any kind), when she wanted things, etc. Nothing I could ever do was good enough, big enough, or quick enough! And I mean NOTHING! She was constantly keeping me in a state of walking on eggshells as a means of controlling and manipulating my behaviour. I NEVER HAD "ME" TIME! I held down two jobs, and did the car repairs, the house repairs and improvements, the cooking, the laundry, the vacuuming, took care of the dogs and cat, maintained her computer, looked after the fish, drove her around to different functions, did the grocery shopping and meal planning, paid night. Yes, if she wanted to "talk" then she would wake me up in the middle of the night! Or if she heard a sound, I was woken up. Or if the dogs had to go out, I was woken up….. I do not have the specifics of your situation, but you need to think long and hard about the possibility that your wife was being abusive towards you. If in doubt, read the book "The Verbally Abusive Relationship" by Evans. All you need do is reverse the gender roles and see if she fits the pattern. Mine certainly did – LOUD AND CLEAR. The reason you need to understand this scenario is this: If she was abusive and manipulating you, then it is not your "fault". If this is the case, then there is NOTHING that you could have done! My ex used to complain that I never made any advances toward her (untrue by the way). So I waited a discrete amount of time and tried (not wanting to appear "obvious") and made appropraitely timed advances. And, of course, I was rejected! When I would try to kiss her she would screw her face up and turn her head away from me like kissing me was repugnant (sp?)!!! So it was damned if you do, damned if you don’t! This is the type of pattern abusers like because no mater what you do, they wind up in control! Think very carefully. I personally doubt if there is anything to save in your failed relationship. However, you might want to go to counselling FOR YOU so that you understand what caused you to choose a woman like that in the first place. Hopefully this will prevent you from choosing another one just like her (or worse) in the future. Just my $0.02 from my painful experience. Lloyd Before you buy.

Response:

my ex used to come home from work and rant and rave as soon as she walked in the door.i realized because of her stressful job she had to let off some steam.unfortunately at me and my daughter.so i would listen.i would interupt her and try to fix the problem.she wasnt interested in me trying to fix it , she just wanted me to shut up and listen..when i realized that it was too late. we had lost our love and communication.and when she asked me to do a chore or favor it had to be done now.not a minute later or tommorrow , but , now.i got that one too late too.whe she wanted me to massage her back that was all no hanky panky.yep missed that one too.when she wanted her tv time (usually lifetime ) that was her time.oops forgot about that one .when she was on the phone that was her time,my daughter couldnt remember that one either.when she wanted to go to dinner and a movie i wasnt supposed to expect a romantic ending..oops again ..i wonder why after 10 years of marriage that i coulnt figure all this out being in my own home wondering what to say or do without creating an arguement but now that im single…its my time Hi Douglas, You certainly have a good handle on what has happened. It is sad to say, but this happens in most relationships. It boils down to communication. We tend not to be able to communicate clearly what we need and want. Sometimes it isn’t all that clear within us either. I find that women, are overstressed in life. Not to say that men aren’t, but our stress is a bit different. I know for myself, always working a full-time and quite stressful job, then to come home and be on demand to direct and manage the household, childrens activities and be the best lover, is all so much on my plate. In the end it leaves me with little self time. Very little real self time. I might be flaked out in my chair staring aimlessly at the TV in a brief intermission, but this is not self time. Wh enever I would communicate I needed this, my husband would take offense that I did not want to be with him, or the children. Would play that guilt trip and ensure that I would not enjoy my self time. He had a comment about any of my friends, he would balk and be unsupportive on any activities I would chose to do. The expectation that a massage would turn into sex was tension. If that tension wasn’t there, a massage would most always result in very pleasurable sex. I think it became the expectation that loomed over us that killed it. But having the massage first was much better then having him awake at 11:00 pm after his beer nap on the couch and I having completed all the childrens homework, housework, and put the children off to bed and he would expect for us to crawl into bed and have sex. So I guess I opt for the massage way, at least there was an effort for foreplay and some attention. I think it is hard for us to understand where the other is coming from and when there is a lack of true, honest, open communication there is definitely no way we are ever going to understand and things eventually take their toll and both parties end up resenting the other. From this point, I think there is little chance of turning things around. But there is still a little chance. If that is there,for you, try, try real hard. Go to counselling, for couples weekends at a personal development retreat or something. You both might find a real understanding and respect for each other to rebuild on. Best to you From one who let it go to far, Glos

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Well, it’s one of many things <G I own a pair of Doc Martins, a pair of winter boots and when the weather warms up I’ll pick up a new pair of tennis shoes. But then I’m probably weird too.

Wow,….Doc Martins. Those are more than twenny bucks, eh? I just scotch gard the chucks fer snow. More’n a foot and the stuff goes in the top of whatever yer wearin’ anyway. — CJ da Yooper icq #96138398 "…..you can always tell when you’re in God’s country,…all the trees point to Him"

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Is there not one man out there woho likes to be romanitc withoUT having sex right away?

Yes. Me. — CJ da Yooper icq #96138398 "…..you can always tell when you’re in God’s country,…all the trees point to Him"

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In article

It’s kind of funny–I keep my shoes all jumbled together in a cardboard box, and one day I looked in and realized that they were *all black*. That’ll cut down on the number of pairs you need–I’ve got one pair in each of the basic styles–dressy sandals, pseudobirkenstocks, pumps, flats, tennis shoes, fashion boots, and winter boots. Wow. I thought it was: Dressy, walking around in, running. Must be those crossed chromosomes. 3 pair shoes per X? No, I think it’s more like 2 pairs of shoes (one dressy, one comfy) per temperature level: hot, mild, and bloody-f*ing cold.

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Lonely Loneliness

You are not alone — Lonely Loneliness