Why having a girlfriend isn't always a solution

Question:

ternym…@yahoo.com.au (Aster Boynton) wrote in message

<news:7aca9183.0310030031.3ff9f558@posting.google.com>… > When I was in year 8, I didn’t even know what a lesbian was! > In fact someone asked me whether I was gay and I said yes, > because I though gay meant happy. (This was in the mid-1980s.)

I didn’t even know about the *existence* of homosexuality until I was 19 (six months after I turned 19, in fact). Although this was in May 1978, I suspect that fewer than 1% of the college students where I was at didn’t know about the existence of homosexuality then, especially given that the university I was attending was probably the most gay-conscious university on the East Coast of the U.S. at the time (Chapel-Hill, NC). Virgo Cluster "[10 Phobias of the Famous] (#2) Nicolae Ceausescu and Marlene Dietrich: bacilophobia (fear of germs). The former Rumanian dictator and his wife once staged a "walk-about" for publicity purposes, which required them to shake a few hands and kiss small children. The secret police selected a few volunteers beforehand and had them locked up for weeks and regularly disinfected in readiness for the big day. Marlene Dietrich’s obsession led her to be known by Hollywood insiders as "the Queen of Ajax"." << Karl Shaw, "The Mammoth Book of Tasteless Lists", Carroll & Graf Publishers, 1998, p. 203 >>

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Pumpkinhead wrote: > that I could have) in the hope that a relationship based on love would have a chance to > develop. That’s how low I would have gone to try to possibly, just slightly raise my > chances of earning some loving feelings from a girl. I’m not interested in that approach > now though. I’ve developed a lot of self respect over the last year.

I’m currently fighting with myself over this. Whatever the decision is, it surely fucks up my head. Declining to have sex is stupid but having it and getting attached to a girl who doesn’t want anything more is every bit as bad. Then again this is highly theoretical anyhow. I don’t really expect the situation to arise ever again (as long as I resist the temptation to fly over to Asia, at least).

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dynami…@hotmail.com (timescape) wrote in message <news:ac5b26c1.0310021255.3e6c07e9@posting.google.com>… > My girlfriend told me today that on the night I met her (in a night > club) she pulled (probably not part of American vocab: basically > French kissed)

Ah. I was thinking it must have meant something else. Ahem. > Not much saddens me more than hearing about the extent of > most girls (and guys for that matter) success with the opposite sex, > and the grim realisation that really I have acheived so little.

Ditto. It seems to be getting worse. I was talking with some girls IRL earlier this week (doing my usual "just friends" routine, *kickself*), and they said even they were shocked during their final year of High School to find out that the year 9 students were all having sex. And a group of year 8 girls made a lesbian porn video and tried to sell it to some guys for $90 or something. When I was in year 8, I didn’t even know what a lesbian was! In fact someone asked me whether I was gay and I said yes, because I though gay meant happy. (This was in the mid-1980s.) > Expecting monogomy once you become official is a bit like expecting > a tiger to become domesticated overnight. Futile.

In the relationship that I idealise about this would be a problem for me. But in the relationship that I am willing to settle for as a matter of practicality (in which I’m happy to just experience a kiss and cuddle and then get dumped) I could live with it.

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"timescape" <dynami…@hotmail.com> wrote in message

news:ac5b26c1.0310022158.44c3b5c5@posting.google.com… > Yes I’m from the UK, have to disagree with your definition though. > I’ve only ever heard the phrase used in the context of kissing with > tongues.

I always thought "pulled" = "took home for sex"!

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dynami…@hotmail.com (timescape) wrote in message > > > My girlfriend told me today that on the night I met her (in a night > > > club) she pulled (probably not part of American vocab: basically > > > French kissed) 8 other guys. > > Are you from the UK? Here in the UK to "pull" is to pick someone up, as in > > "I pulled this bird in the pub last night". > Yes I’m from the UK, have to disagree with your definition though. > I’ve only ever heard the phrase used in the context of kissing with > tongues. I have a feeling the phrase has evolved from picking up to > just French-kissing now.

I think Espiranto-speaking-zombie is right: pulled means to pick up, as in "get your coat love you’ve pulled". Basically if you pull a girl it means you either fucked her, or got to being able later, like getting a phone # and agreeing to phone later. It’s usually blokes who say they’ve pulled because it’s no big deal for a girl to pull unless (a) she’s really ugly or (b) she’s trying to be oh-so like Carrie from Sex in the City and pull guys above her level. > > > For shy guys who are looking to form lasting relationships with girls > > > I would probably rule out the clubbing scene. > > Sounds great if you just want sex tho! Anyway, look at it this way: she > > picked to be with you instead of those 8 other guys that night. > Well that’s a nice way of looking at it

I wouldn’t worry too much about your missus kissing 8 blokes in one night because alcohol is a disinfectant, and obviously she would have been drinking a hell of lot of it that particular night. But 21 in a night means she is a slag.

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dynami…@hotmail.com (timescape) wrote in news:ac5b26c1.0310022232.50351c1@posting.google.com: – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Solitary Soul <solitarys…@ev1.net> wrote in message > <news:8n4pnvoq7odm8qs2s81gvq9q6gmsob6o14@4ax.com>…> >> Are you certain that she is "exclusive" with you now? > Funny you should say that, I find myself getting seriously paranoid > about what she gets up to when I’m not around. For someone like her > the ease with which she can attract a number of guys in any one night > is really quite unsettling. That’s why I can’t help but feel insecure > when she drops nuggets of information about what she’s got up to in > the past, as it may as well be the present she’s talking about. She > could go out tonight and get as many numbers and all the male > attention she wants. How can I compete with that? > On the night that I broke up with her (the break was less than 24 > hours) we were both out and she was able to spend the whole night with > this other guy who she knew, pulling him. The same guy is still > lingering around (she makes a point of dropping in his name to > conversations with an unnerving regularity). And I know for a fact all > it would take from her is another ‘yes’ and he’d be there in a > heartbeat. The whole relationship feels like I’m walking on ice, if I > put a foot wrong there are plenty of other guys willing to take my > place. Whereas with me it would take so much longer to get over a > break-up, with no concrete replacement on the horizon.

I’d say get rid of her. No one is worth having to put up with that.

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"Esperanto-speaking undead zombie porcupine-dodo from the 7.56391th dimension?" <vog…@btinternet.com> wrote in news:bli9om$ch6jp$2@ID-163425.news.uni-berlin.de: > "timescape" <dynami…@hotmail.com> wrote in message > news:ac5b26c1.0310021255.3e6c07e9@posting.google.com… >> My girlfriend told me today that on the night I met her (in a night >> club) she pulled (probably not part of American vocab: basically >> French kissed) 8 other guys. > Are you from the UK? Here in the UK to "pull" is to pick someone up, > as in "I pulled this bird in the pub last night".

Having my bird in my hand is worth twice as much as in a bush.

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I’d say get out and spend some of your life taking care of the fact that you seem to feel undesireable.

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Pumpkinhead wrote: >>A condom isn’t perfect, but it’ll help keep down box pox. Maybe those guys >>didn’t mean anything to her, anyway, and he means something to her. > How can a woman treat guys who mean something to her and guys who don’t mean anything to > her the same way? Doesn’t meaning something to a girl…..well…..mean anything?

Just like I can screw a girl’s brains out whether or not she means anything to me. No difficulty there (aside of the fact that pulling off the later is vastly easier).

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"Animeg3282" <animeg3…@aol.compelsia> wrote in message

news:20031002174350.00143.00000159@mb-m27.aol.com… > micky said > >Look at the positive side. Do you really want to wait months and months > >before getting intimate? > A condom isn’t perfect, but it’ll help keep down box pox. Maybe those guys > didn’t mean anything to her, anyway, and he means something to her.

How can a woman treat guys who mean something to her and guys who don’t mean anything to her the same way? Doesn’t meaning something to a girl…..well…..mean anything?

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Pumpkinhead saod >How can a woman treat guys who mean something to her and guys who don’t mean >anything to >her the same way? Doesn’t meaning something to a girl…..well…..mean >anything?

I don’t know about this particular woman(women are not a huge monolith). But seriously, kissing is sometimes just kissing. With an actual relationship, you have to show love and care, gotta see your partner through the down times, gotta enjoy their up times. — http://animeg.blogspot.com/ <–yet another shitty blog. http://members.fortunecity.com/animeg3282/ <—Fancy Lala Club! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/fancy_lala <mailing list for Lala fans

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"Animeg3282" <animeg3…@aol.compelsia> wrote in message

news:20031002192916.16739.00000164@mb-m07.aol.com… > Pumpkinhead saod > >How can a woman treat guys who mean something to her and guys who don’t mean > >anything to > >her the same way? Doesn’t meaning something to a girl…..well…..mean > >anything? > I don’t know about this particular woman(women are not a huge monolith). But > seriously, kissing is sometimes just kissing.

So a girl could go around "meaninglessly" kissing lots of men and because it’s "just kissing", a guy should be happy with it? You could also say that sex is sometimes just sex. I guess for many people, it is though. That doesn’t mean I have to like it. I’ve got to be honest. I’ve considered having meaningless sex in the past (I’m not saying that I could have) in the hope that a relationship based on love would have a chance to develop. That’s how low I would have gone to try to possibly, just slightly raise my chances of earning some loving feelings from a girl. I’m not interested in that approach now though. I’ve developed a lot of self respect over the last year. > With an actual relationship, you > have to show love and care, gotta see your partner through the down times, > gotta enjoy their up times.

That’s not all a relationship should be about. You didn’t mention this thing called devotion. I guess that doesn’t interest you though. I believe in the importance of only engaging in sexual activity with the one you love.

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> When problems arose, instead of confronting me and working things out, > she knew that she could easily quit and just give up and start dating > somebody new. She knew that all she had to do was go into a chatroom or > put up a personals ad and she could easily have a new guy and solve all > her problems. Even with all her experience , she has yet to learn that > there is no such thing as a "perfect man", and she won’t find him no > matter how hard she shops on the internet for one. If her current one > turns out to have problems, instead of putting in the hard work of > resolving things she will probably just dump him and put the personals ad > back up.

Big snips, but this part sounds especially solid to me. Your past is the path to your future. If she’s used to jumping from guy to guy, it’s gonna take a lot of work for her to stop.

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -On Thu, 02 Oct 2003 22:45:48 GMT, Dan <Dan3…@NOSPAMdelphi.net> wrote: >timescape wrote: >> For shy guys who are looking to form lasting relationships with girls >> I would probably rule out the clubbing scene. Or if you go down that >> avenue seriously prepare to desenstize yourself about young women’s >> promiscuity. You’ll likely be saddened and shocked at the same time >> when their past comes to a head. Expecting monogomy once you become >> official is a bit like expecting a tiger to become domesticated >> overnight. Futile. > I’m sorry to hear about your experience, I had a similar one, >although my girlfriend’s promiscuity was 10 years in the past, and I >figured that she had grown past it, and I got much further involved before >it all fell apart. She was a virgin up until age 25 or so, and then she >got into meeting guys that she had talked to in online chat rooms. She had >sex with many of them, and there are some whose names she can’t even >remember. This went on for a year or so, then she remained celibate up >until the time she got engaged. The marriage went bad, and I ended up >meeting her online (not in a chat room) around the time she was deciding >to end things. At first I was hesitant to talk to a married woman, and I >even suggested that she should consider marriage counseling, but she told >me he had hit her on a number of occassions, so how can you save a >marriage like that? I ended up traveling across country to meet her after >her divorce became final, and we started a long-distance relationship. I >have to admit that in the beginning I saw her promiscuous past as a "red >flag", but at the same time I wanted to believe that she had gotten that >out of her system and grown beyond that. > Anyway, I’ll try to make a long story short. A few months after I left >to go back to college, she got mixed up in a website chatroom . The main >topic of this chatroom was sex, and she started enjoying the attention >that she was getting from guys in the room, it reminded her of the old >days online. I remember when she first told me about it I became sick at >my stomach and shook uncontrollably for about 10 minutes, because I had an >ominous feeling that she would be returning to her old ways and would want >to take another "bite at the apple". She ended up meeting one of these >guys for a parking lot "encounter". We fought about it a bit, but she >played up the distance and loneliness bit, saying that if I had been there >it wouldn’t have happened, so I did my best to forgive it and let it go. >Fast forward to a year later, she went back into the same chat room she >swore she would never go in again, and ended up having one of the guys pay >her a visit. Again we fought about it, she threatened to "break things >off" with me like I was the bad guy, and again she played up the >loneliness angle, so I wimped out again and let it go. A year later we had >a bit of a falling out; instead of working things out with me she broke >things off with me and began pursuing a guy at work. We got back together, >I made the move to be with her, and within a few months the same thing >happened again. It wasn’t easy making the adjustment to living together >permanently, and instead of working on things she did her usual thing of >giving up on me and running into another man’s arms. > Here’s the deal. I was stupid, and I’m embarassed to admit that I >kept going back to this woman. It’s just that she was my first love, and I >loved her dearly, she’s a wonderful woman in most respects, and I just >didn’t want to let her go. I think our biggest problem in forming a >relationship is that there was a huge mismatch in terms of relationship >experience. I had never had even so much as a platonic female friend in my >29 years, much less a "girlfriend". This woman has had so many guys that >she can’t even remember some of their names. Plus she had the experience >of being married. So she had already learned some things and experienced >some things that were all new territories for me. And I made a lot of >mistakes along the way, but unfortunately they had to be fatal ones, I >wasn’t allowed to learn from them and grow. This is where I think her >promiscuous past comes into play in terms of the relationship not working. >When problems arose, instead of confronting me and working things out, >she knew that she could easily quit and just give up and start dating >somebody new. She knew that all she had to do was go into a chatroom or >put up a personals ad and she could easily have a new guy and solve all >her problems. Even with all her experience , she has yet to learn that >there is no such thing as a "perfect man", and she won’t find him no >matter how hard she shops on the internet for one. If her current one >turns out to have problems, instead of putting in the hard work of >resolving things she will probably just dump him and put the personals ad >back up. > I’m not saying that you should automatically reject someone just >because they have had a promiscuous past, however, it is something that >you should consider long and hard before making a committment to that >person. If you aren’t as "experienced" in the dating game, it could spell >big trouble for your relationship. Also, be prepared to be constantly >compared to past lovers, if she isn’t doing it out loud she is doing it in >her mind. No matter how hard you try, you may not measure up to some of >those guys in terms of social status, looks, being "fun", on and on. And >most likely, none of those guys will have been the least bit shy. So she >will always be wondering "what if" she had one of those guys instead of >you. Having been with so many me, she will most likely be wondering what >else is "out there" for her in the dating world. And having had so many >guys, she will have the mindset that there will always be something else >easily available to her, so there is not as much incentive for her to try >and work things out with you when the going gets rough (which in most >relationships it will, at some point). Also, having had so many guys she >will likely be addicted to the "rush" that comes with being with somebody >new (to her being infatuated with someone will most likely be the same >feeling as truly being "in love"). However, unfortunately, given today’s >social climate it is unlikey that you will meet someone who hasn’t had a >"past", unless you marry your high school sweetheart (something a lot of >us never had). So just be careful, and don’t make a serious committment >until you are absolutely sure that he or she wants you and you alone. And >if that person strays or betrays you even once, don’t walk away, RUN. No >excuses. Life is to short to waste on people like that …..

Were there any kids involved? Solitary Soul -> http://users3.ev1.net/~solitarysoul/ —————————————————– In my experience, there is no excuse for thinking positively. – ASStagon

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Dan <Dan3…@NOSPAMdelphi.net> wrote in message > I’m sorry to hear about your experience, I had a similar one, > although my girlfriend’s promiscuity was 10 years in the past, and I > figured that she had grown past it, and I got much further involved before > it all fell apart.

That’s why history is so important. She was a virgin up until age 25 or so, and then she > got into meeting guys that she had talked to in online chat rooms. She had > sex with many of them, and there are some whose names she can’t even > remember.

At this point, you should have run for the hills. This went on for a year or so, then she remained celibate up > until the time she got engaged. The marriage went bad, and I ended up > meeting her online (not in a chat room) around the time she was deciding > to end things. At first I was hesitant to talk to a married woman, and I > even suggested that she should consider marriage counseling, but she told > me he had hit her on a number of occassions, so how can you save a > marriage like that? I ended up traveling across country to meet her after > her divorce became final, and we started a long-distance relationship. I > have to admit that in the beginning I saw her promiscuous past as a "red > flag", but at the same time I wanted to believe that she had gotten that > out of her system and grown beyond that.

Well, at least you realize the danger of believing what you "want to believe". Been there, done that. It’s an easy mistake to make. > Here’s the deal. I was stupid, and I’m embarassed to admit that I > kept going back to this woman.

You’re man enough to admit it to yourself. That says a lot. It’s just that she was my first love, and I > loved her dearly, she’s a wonderful woman in most respects, and I just > didn’t want to let her go. I think our biggest problem in forming a > relationship is that there was a huge mismatch in terms of relationship > experience. I had never had even so much as a platonic female friend in my > 29 years, much less a "girlfriend". This woman has had so many guys that > she can’t even remember some of their names.

And that’s a PLUS???!!!! Plus she had the experience > of being married. So she had already learned some things and experienced > some things that were all new territories for me. And I made a lot of > mistakes along the way, but unfortunately they had to be fatal ones, I > wasn’t allowed to learn from them and grow.

I think it is a sign of a high quality person that you are willing to take responsibility for poor decisions…namely the decisions both to go out with this person in the first place, and to stick with her after her astonishing behaviors. Those were indeed poor decisions. But you are taking it too far. You are blaming yourself for a lack of experience. So your relationship would have been better if you had countless encounters with women who’s names you can’t remember? That would make you a better guy? But more to the point, how in the world would that make a relationship work with someone who is clearly a dishonest cheat? Your only mistake here was in getting and staying involved with a woman who put out more red flags than a Soviet May Day parade. The only way the relationship could have "worked" is if you became a degenerate cheat yourself, a real low-life. Same logic as two heroin addicts can have a relationship together. But clearly you are better than that. This is where I think her > promiscuous past comes into play in terms of the relationship not working. > When problems arose, instead of confronting me and working things out, > she knew that she could easily quit and just give up and start dating > somebody new. She knew that all she had to do was go into a chatroom or > put up a personals ad and she could easily have a new guy and solve all > her problems. Even with all her experience , she has yet to learn that > there is no such thing as a "perfect man", and she won’t find him no > matter how hard she shops on the internet for one. If her current one > turns out to have problems, instead of putting in the hard work of > resolving things she will probably just dump him and put the personals ad > back up.

You still keep harping on her "experience" as if it were a postitive. It is not. She is simply a low quality person doing what low quality people do. Your biggest concern should no longer be her, but your own physical safety. I think a STD test would be a good idea. > I’m not saying that you should automatically reject someone just > because they have had a promiscuous past, however, it is something that > you should consider long and hard before making a committment to that > person.

Absolutely. I’ve learned to pretty much automatically reject, but in the past I was a little more open. However, there are still enough "nice" girls out there, why settle for a "reformed" (possibly) sleazeball? If you aren’t as "experienced" in the dating game, it could spell > big trouble for your relationship.

Here we go again. How in the world is your "experience" going to make a relationship work with a dishonest, hurtful cheat? You need to really understand this, or it is likely that you are going to scew up again. A low quality person is a low quality person…YOUR experience has nothing to do with it. You didn’t make her what she is, and you won’t change her either. You could have all the experience in the world, and it wouldn’t change the fact that she’s a dishonest cheat. All your experience likely would have only served to give you a jaded heart, and possibly some disturbing news from a medical office. Also, be prepared to be constantly > compared to past lovers, if she isn’t doing it out loud she is doing it in > her mind.

Then don’t date sleazbags. Or better yet, always be willing to improve your sex life with a girl so that you are both happy with it. Point is, you were dating a low-life. That is the issue here, and nothing you could do will change that. No matter how hard you try, you may not measure up to some of > those guys in terms of social status, looks, being "fun", on and on.

This is totally the wrong attitude. And > most likely, none of those guys will have been the least bit shy. So she > will always be wondering "what if" she had one of those guys instead of > you. Having been with so many me, she will most likely be wondering what > else is "out there" for her in the dating world.

You make her dishonesty, deceit and hurtfulness sound perfectly valid. In reality, promiscuous women are almost always borderline mental cases. Whether they started out nuts, or their experiences made them nuts…it’s hard to say. Probably a little bit of both. But normal, healthy women do not behave the way your girlfriend did. So stop rationalizing for her. And having had so many > guys, she will have the mindset that there will always be something else > easily available to her, so there is not as much incentive for her to try > and work things out with you when the going gets rough (which in most > relationships it will, at some point).

Most girls know that. Attractive girls get hit on…whether they are in a relationship with you or not. That’s not the issue. The issue is quality. A quality woman would not have behaved like your girlfriend did. Also, having had so many guys she > will likely be addicted to the "rush" that comes with being with somebody > new (to her being infatuated with someone will most likely be the same > feeling as truly being "in love"). However, unfortunately, given today’s > social climate it is unlikey that you will meet someone who hasn’t had a > "past", unless you marry your high school sweetheart (something a lot of > us never had). So just be careful, and don’t make a serious committment > until you are absolutely sure that he or she wants you and you alone. And > if that person strays or betrays you even once, don’t walk away, RUN. No > excuses. Life is to short to waste on people like that …..

I guess all’s well that end’s well, because I agree with the last paragraph wholeheartedly. And remember, you aren’t the only one that has made the mistake of seeing what he wanted to see…until it was too late. We’ve all done it.

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dynami…@hotmail.com (timescape) wrote in message > Another revelation was her telling me today that she once pulled 21 > guys in one night. That’s more than I’ve had in a lifetime and I > consider myself fairly fortunate compared to some. These sort of > numbers make me hopelessly aware of my own inadequacy, they really are > a kick in the balls when I feel like I’ve made so much progress this > last year.

Why should YOU feel inadequate about her promiscuous behavior? I understand the "kick in the balls" part…after all you found out that things were not as they appeared. But inadequate? Hardly. She is the one who has revealed herself to be of either low character, or at best extremely flaky. Forget her…she sounds like she’s not worth it. Not much saddens me more than hearing about the extent of > most girls (and guys for that matter) success with the opposite sex, > and the grim realisation that really I have acheived so little.

This is an unwarranted conclusion. What she "achieved" was hardly success. > For shy guys who are looking to form lasting relationships with girls > I would probably rule out the clubbing scene. Or if you go down that > avenue seriously prepare to desenstize yourself about young women’s > promiscuity. You’ll likely be saddened and shocked at the same time > when their past comes to a head. Expecting monogomy once you become > official is a bit like expecting a tiger to become domesticated > overnight. Futile.

There is a fair amount of truth to that. In any event, try to drop the inadequacy thing. If you found out your girlfriend had been a hooker once and had slept with thousands of guys, would you feel "inadequate"? Or disgust? I sincerely hope it would be the latter.

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Dan <Dan3…@NOSPAMdelphi.net> wrote in message <news:3F7C9C25.DCE8B3DC@NOSPAMdelphi.net>…

<snipped> – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> When problems arose, instead of confronting me and working things out, > she knew that she could easily quit and just give up and start dating > somebody new. She knew that all she had to do was go into a chatroom or > put up a personals ad and she could easily have a new guy and solve all > her problems. Even with all her experience , she has yet to learn that > there is no such thing as a "perfect man", and she won’t find him no > matter how hard she shops on the internet for one. If her current one > turns out to have problems, instead of putting in the hard work of > resolving things she will probably just dump him and put the personals ad > back up. > I’m not saying that you should automatically reject someone just > because they have had a promiscuous past, however, it is something that > you should consider long and hard before making a committment to that > person. If you aren’t as "experienced" in the dating game, it could spell > big trouble for your relationship. Also, be prepared to be constantly > compared to past lovers, if she isn’t doing it out loud she is doing it in > her mind. No matter how hard you try, you may not measure up to some of > those guys in terms of social status, looks, being "fun", on and on. And > most likely, none of those guys will have been the least bit shy. So she > will always be wondering "what if" she had one of those guys instead of > you. Having been with so many me, she will most likely be wondering what > else is "out there" for her in the dating world. And having had so many > guys, she will have the mindset that there will always be something else > easily available to her, so there is not as much incentive for her to try > and work things out with you when the going gets rough (which in most > relationships it will, at some point). Also, having had so many guys she > will likely be addicted to the "rush" that comes with being with somebody > new (to her being infatuated with someone will most likely be the same > feeling as truly being "in love"). However, unfortunately, given today’s > social climate it is unlikey that you will meet someone who hasn’t had a > "past", unless you marry your high school sweetheart (something a lot of > us never had). So just be careful, and don’t make a serious committment > until you are absolutely sure that he or she wants you and you alone. And > if that person strays or betrays you even once, don’t walk away, RUN. No > excuses. Life is to short to waste on people like that …..

Wow, thanks for your post, a lot of food for thought. I can totally relate to everything you say, of the girls I’ve been with it seems I fall short of their expectations and without fail everytime there has been another guy only too willing to replace me. Always happens to be the guy she was with before me, and who for some reason comes up into conversation regularly. What you say about being compared to past lovers is so true, they rarely do it out loud but now and again you can almost hear their thoughts they’re that predictable. The trouble is they’ll always look back to past relationships with rose-tinted glasses, remembering the positives. Memory has a funny habit of fogetting the bad aspects sometimes. Meanwhile you’re trying to compete with an unacheivable ideal. My girlfriend has more of a history than I’ve hinted at, to be honest the kissing the other guys is just the tip of the iceberg. The reason her first relationship ended was because she slept with someone else while they were still together.

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"Esperanto-speaking undead zombie porcupine-dodo from the 7.56391th dimension?" <vog…@btinternet.com> wrote in message <news:bli9om$ch6jp$2@ID-163425.news.uni-berlin.de>… > "timescape" <dynami…@hotmail.com> wrote in message > news:ac5b26c1.0310021255.3e6c07e9@posting.google.com… > > My girlfriend told me today that on the night I met her (in a night > > club) she pulled (probably not part of American vocab: basically > > French kissed) 8 other guys. > Are you from the UK? Here in the UK to "pull" is to pick someone up, as in > "I pulled this bird in the pub last night".

Yes I’m from the UK, have to disagree with your definition though. I’ve only ever heard the phrase used in the context of kissing with tongues. I have a feeling the phrase has evolved from picking up to just French-kissing now. Out of interest I take it you’re 25+? > > For shy guys who are looking to form lasting relationships with girls > > I would probably rule out the clubbing scene. > Sounds great if you just want sex tho! Anyway, look at it this way: she > picked to be with you instead of those 8 other guys that night.

Well that’s a nice way of looking at it, thanks! The just wanting sex part is all well and good in theory, but then once you get to that stage feelings have a funny habit of intensifying and the thought of her being free to shag other guys repulses you. So before you know it you have to become official, and the just sex part sort of goes out the window.

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Solitary Soul <solitarys…@ev1.net> wrote in message <news:8n4pnvoq7odm8qs2s81gvq9q6gmsob6o14@4ax.com>…> > Are you certain that she is "exclusive" with you now?

Funny you should say that, I find myself getting seriously paranoid about what she gets up to when I’m not around. For someone like her the ease with which she can attract a number of guys in any one night is really quite unsettling. That’s why I can’t help but feel insecure when she drops nuggets of information about what she’s got up to in the past, as it may as well be the present she’s talking about. She could go out tonight and get as many numbers and all the male attention she wants. How can I compete with that? On the night that I broke up with her (the break was less than 24 hours) we were both out and she was able to spend the whole night with this other guy who she knew, pulling him. The same guy is still lingering around (she makes a point of dropping in his name to conversations with an unnerving regularity). And I know for a fact all it would take from her is another ‘yes’ and he’d be there in a heartbeat. The whole relationship feels like I’m walking on ice, if I put a foot wrong there are plenty of other guys willing to take my place. Whereas with me it would take so much longer to get over a break-up, with no concrete replacement on the horizon.

Response:

micky said >Look at the positive side. Do you really want to wait months and months >before getting intimate?

A condom isn’t perfect, but it’ll help keep down box pox. Maybe those guys didn’t mean anything to her, anyway, and he means something to her. — http://animeg.blogspot.com/ <–yet another shitty blog. http://members.fortunecity.com/animeg3282/ <—Fancy Lala Club! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/fancy_lala <mailing list for Lala fans

Response:

timescape wrote: > For shy guys who are looking to form lasting relationships with girls > I would probably rule out the clubbing scene. Or if you go down that > avenue seriously prepare to desenstize yourself about young women’s > promiscuity. You’ll likely be saddened and shocked at the same time > when their past comes to a head. Expecting monogomy once you become > official is a bit like expecting a tiger to become domesticated > overnight. Futile.

I’m sorry to hear about your experience, I had a similar one, although my girlfriend’s promiscuity was 10 years in the past, and I figured that she had grown past it, and I got much further involved before it all fell apart. She was a virgin up until age 25 or so, and then she got into meeting guys that she had talked to in online chat rooms. She had sex with many of them, and there are some whose names she can’t even remember. This went on for a year or so, then she remained celibate up until the time she got engaged. The marriage went bad, and I ended up meeting her online (not in a chat room) around the time she was deciding to end things. At first I was hesitant to talk to a married woman, and I even suggested that she should consider marriage counseling, but she told me he had hit her on a number of occassions, so how can you save a marriage like that? I ended up traveling across country to meet her after her divorce became final, and we started a long-distance relationship. I have to admit that in the beginning I saw her promiscuous past as a "red flag", but at the same time I wanted to believe that she had gotten that out of her system and grown beyond that. Anyway, I’ll try to make a long story short. A few months after I left to go back to college, she got mixed up in a website chatroom . The main topic of this chatroom was sex, and she started enjoying the attention that she was getting from guys in the room, it reminded her of the old days online. I remember when she first told me about it I became sick at my stomach and shook uncontrollably for about 10 minutes, because I had an ominous feeling that she would be returning to her old ways and would want to take another "bite at the apple". She ended up meeting one of these guys for a parking lot "encounter". We fought about it a bit, but she played up the distance and loneliness bit, saying that if I had been there it wouldn’t have happened, so I did my best to forgive it and let it go. Fast forward to a year later, she went back into the same chat room she swore she would never go in again, and ended up having one of the guys pay her a visit. Again we fought about it, she threatened to "break things off" with me like I was the bad guy, and again she played up the loneliness angle, so I wimped out again and let it go. A year later we had a bit of a falling out; instead of working things out with me she broke things off with me and began pursuing a guy at work. We got back together, I made the move to be with her, and within a few months the same thing happened again. It wasn’t easy making the adjustment to living together permanently, and instead of working on things she did her usual thing of giving up on me and running into another man’s arms. Here’s the deal. I was stupid, and I’m embarassed to admit that I kept going back to this woman. It’s just that she was my first love, and I loved her dearly, she’s a wonderful woman in most respects, and I just didn’t want to let her go. I think our biggest problem in forming a relationship is that there was a huge mismatch in terms of relationship experience. I had never had even so much as a platonic female friend in my 29 years, much less a "girlfriend". This woman has had so many guys that she can’t even remember some of their names. Plus she had the experience of being married. So she had already learned some things and experienced some things that were all new territories for me. And I made a lot of mistakes along the way, but unfortunately they had to be fatal ones, I wasn’t allowed to learn from them and grow. This is where I think her promiscuous past comes into play in terms of the relationship not working. When problems arose, instead of confronting me and working things out, she knew that she could easily quit and just give up and start dating somebody new. She knew that all she had to do was go into a chatroom or put up a personals ad and she could easily have a new guy and solve all her problems. Even with all her experience , she has yet to learn that there is no such thing as a "perfect man", and she won’t find him no matter how hard she shops on the internet for one. If her current one turns out to have problems, instead of putting in the hard work of resolving things she will probably just dump him and put the personals ad back up. I’m not saying that you should automatically reject someone just because they have had a promiscuous past, however, it is something that you should consider long and hard before making a committment to that person. If you aren’t as "experienced" in the dating game, it could spell big trouble for your relationship. Also, be prepared to be constantly compared to past lovers, if she isn’t doing it out loud she is doing it in her mind. No matter how hard you try, you may not measure up to some of those guys in terms of social status, looks, being "fun", on and on. And most likely, none of those guys will have been the least bit shy. So she will always be wondering "what if" she had one of those guys instead of you. Having been with so many me, she will most likely be wondering what else is "out there" for her in the dating world. And having had so many guys, she will have the mindset that there will always be something else easily available to her, so there is not as much incentive for her to try and work things out with you when the going gets rough (which in most relationships it will, at some point). Also, having had so many guys she will likely be addicted to the "rush" that comes with being with somebody new (to her being infatuated with someone will most likely be the same feeling as truly being "in love"). However, unfortunately, given today’s social climate it is unlikey that you will meet someone who hasn’t had a "past", unless you marry your high school sweetheart (something a lot of us never had). So just be careful, and don’t make a serious committment until you are absolutely sure that he or she wants you and you alone. And if that person strays or betrays you even once, don’t walk away, RUN. No excuses. Life is to short to waste on people like that …..

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -timescape wrote: > For anyone who thinks landing yourself a girlfriend will suddenly turn > things into a bed of roses, think again. A whole new level of problems > can arise. > This isn’t strictly related to shyness but frankly I don’t care: this > is the only usenet group I read, and I still consider myself shy. > My girlfriend told me today that on the night I met her (in a night > club) she pulled (probably not part of American vocab: basically > French kissed) 8 other guys. And I wasn’t the last. She wasn’t even > sure if it was 8 or 16, so for arguments sake I’ll play it safe and go > for the lower number. When I heard this I felt physically sick, the > thought that she had been so intimate with these other guys as well as > me. My mouth had touched the same mouth as these other guys, in the > same night. Seems she got all their phone numbers as well. Finding > this out made me feel like just a number, worse than that actually, > with the realisation I was the only one stupid enough to persue things > with her. > Another revelation was her telling me today that she once pulled 21 > guys in one night. That’s more than I’ve had in a lifetime and I > consider myself fairly fortunate compared to some. These sort of > numbers make me hopelessly aware of my own inadequacy, they really are > a kick in the balls when I feel like I’ve made so much progress this > last year. Not much saddens me more than hearing about the extent of > most girls (and guys for that matter) success with the opposite sex, > and the grim realisation that really I have acheived so little. > For shy guys who are looking to form lasting relationships with girls > I would probably rule out the clubbing scene. Or if you go down that > avenue seriously prepare to desenstize yourself about young women’s > promiscuity. You’ll likely be saddened and shocked at the same time > when their past comes to a head. Expecting monogomy once you become > official is a bit like expecting a tiger to become domesticated > overnight. Futile.

Look at the positive side. Do you really want to wait months and months before getting intimate? -M

Response:

On 2 Oct 2003 13:55:44 -0700, dynami…@hotmail.com (timescape) wrote: – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->For anyone who thinks landing yourself a girlfriend will suddenly turn >things into a bed of roses, think again. A whole new level of problems >can arise. >This isn’t strictly related to shyness but frankly I don’t care: this >is the only usenet group I read, and I still consider myself shy. >My girlfriend told me today that on the night I met her (in a night >club) she pulled (probably not part of American vocab: basically >French kissed) 8 other guys. And I wasn’t the last. She wasn’t even >sure if it was 8 or 16, so for arguments sake I’ll play it safe and go >for the lower number. When I heard this I felt physically sick, the >thought that she had been so intimate with these other guys as well as >me. My mouth had touched the same mouth as these other guys, in the >same night. Seems she got all their phone numbers as well. Finding >this out made me feel like just a number, worse than that actually, >with the realisation I was the only one stupid enough to persue things >with her. >Another revelation was her telling me today that she once pulled 21 >guys in one night. That’s more than I’ve had in a lifetime and I >consider myself fairly fortunate compared to some. These sort of >numbers make me hopelessly aware of my own inadequacy, they really are >a kick in the balls when I feel like I’ve made so much progress this >last year. Not much saddens me more than hearing about the extent of >most girls (and guys for that matter) success with the opposite sex, >and the grim realisation that really I have acheived so little. >For shy guys who are looking to form lasting relationships with girls >I would probably rule out the clubbing scene. Or if you go down that >avenue seriously prepare to desenstize yourself about young women’s >promiscuity. You’ll likely be saddened and shocked at the same time >when their past comes to a head. Expecting monogomy once you become >official is a bit like expecting a tiger to become domesticated >overnight. Futile.

Are you certain that she is "exclusive" with you now? Solitary Soul -> http://users3.ev1.net/~solitarysoul/ —————————————————– In my experience, there is no excuse for thinking positively. – ASStagon

Response:

For anyone who thinks landing yourself a girlfriend will suddenly turn things into a bed of roses, think again. A whole new level of problems can arise. This isn’t strictly related to shyness but frankly I don’t care: this is the only usenet group I read, and I still consider myself shy. My girlfriend told me today that on the night I met her (in a night club) she pulled (probably not part of American vocab: basically French kissed) 8 other guys. And I wasn’t the last. She wasn’t even sure if it was 8 or 16, so for arguments sake I’ll play it safe and go for the lower number. When I heard this I felt physically sick, the thought that she had been so intimate with these other guys as well as me. My mouth had touched the same mouth as these other guys, in the same night. Seems she got all their phone numbers as well. Finding this out made me feel like just a number, worse than that actually, with the realisation I was the only one stupid enough to persue things with her. Another revelation was her telling me today that she once pulled 21 guys in one night. That’s more than I’ve had in a lifetime and I consider myself fairly fortunate compared to some. These sort of numbers make me hopelessly aware of my own inadequacy, they really are a kick in the balls when I feel like I’ve made so much progress this last year. Not much saddens me more than hearing about the extent of most girls (and guys for that matter) success with the opposite sex, and the grim realisation that really I have acheived so little. For shy guys who are looking to form lasting relationships with girls I would probably rule out the clubbing scene. Or if you go down that avenue seriously prepare to desenstize yourself about young women’s promiscuity. You’ll likely be saddened and shocked at the same time when their past comes to a head. Expecting monogomy once you become official is a bit like expecting a tiger to become domesticated overnight. Futile.

Response:

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Lonely Loneliness

You are not alone — Lonely Loneliness